Help! I have tried growing Lotuses about 59 times, NEVER with germination. They get covered in slime, and at best get large air bubbles. The pic below is of a seed that has been in that jar for a month. Should I just pitch it?
uh-oh: Nelumbo seed looks bad...
This is normal as long as you have plenty of light and warm temps it should send out a first leaf soon.
Plantaholic,
I would. Did you file the seed until there was a light spot first? I never had any problem getting them to germinate, however I always had problems getting past the first set of leaves. I had always thought if I tried to germinate the lotus seeds in the spring and put them outside, that maybe that would work - I never got that far.
After filing the hard seed coat and putting them in water, the lotus seeds will swell and then start shooting out leaves - http://www.faculty.sbc.edu/simpson/Lotus/germination.htm
Carolyn
I've never actually done this, but a local pond store, who's advice has always been good so far, grows their own lotus from seed. They shared this: Scratch the seed coat very slightly, place in unchlorinated water, but not distilled water, at a temp of 70. When the first leaf sprouts float the germinating plant in very shallow unchlorinated water in a lotus tub over a bed of clay or kitty litter. As the plant grows it will root itself and you add water as it grows. When rooted gradually harden off and place outside in your pond. The seem to have no trouble producing plant this way. But, like I said, I've never tried it. There is no place in this house I can keep a tub of water of at 70 that the cats wouldn't have a field day with. Oh, I almost forgot, they do have a small glass house that lets in plenty of light, but not bright direct sunlight. I don't know if that is important or not.
I tried three different methods of scarification; light sanding, heavy sanding (until a white circle is visible) and nicking. This seed was sanded until I saw white. There is the slightest hint of green, so I was hoping that might have been a cotyledon starting out. Ironically, I had the glass sitting on a heat mat for several weeks, with no activity aside from swelling. Once I moved it off the mat, but next to it, the action started. That would work with snapple45's instructions, since the grow lights are directly over the heat mat.
I will forge on... I've started two more, so we'll see.
Thanks for your help!
The best way I have started seeds is in aquariums or when spring or summer hits putting them in a shallow pot that holds water and usually 4 to 6 inches of water. The nicked seeds sprout fast. If my memory serves me right 3 to 7 days the seed will well and produce a jelly substance around the seed looking like a giant frog egg. With in 3 to 7 days a leaf will emerge. It is easy to lose a seedling at this time to low light levels or low temps. I found they seem to like it very bright and very hot. The best luck was in the shallow trays were the water got extremely hot in full sun. I thought I had photos of this but I cannot seem to find them at the moment.
Phew! At least the jelly is okay. I have the glass sitting on the heat mat 5" under a grow light, so we'll see. I have saved a couple, so I'll try them in summer.
Thanks!
BTW, that is one MONSTER lotus! I do have one in a water trough, but it certainly hasn't gotten that big yet! (Sadly, the seeds I harvested got thrown away.)
Holy Moley bwilliams! Yu sure know how to grow lotus!
Oh please- I bought it in a tub, so I just kept it alive. The whole trough is in the garage until spring. The cool thing is that the tub also contained about 45 tadpoles and one fishlet, all of whom are hibernating until warm weather. To move the trough in the garage, I had to drain it so that it could be carried by less than 34 people, which meant that I was out in the dark of night with a flashlight and fish net, transferring them one by one to a bucket for transit. It might be a noisy summer...
I think the problem with people growing lotus is they keep them in containers or in areas that are far to small. A lotus needs at least a 4X4 or larger area to look really good. What you see in the photo above and this one as well is bogs that I built for my mother. All I did was dig out a whole 8 feet wide 6 feet wide and 1 foot deep on the edge and 2 feet deep in the middle. The top was leveled off and rocks were laid round the the liner. The center 2 foot area was then filled in with the clay soil I dug out about 9 inches to 1 foot deep. You then add your lotus some fertilizer and a few gold fish that survive just fine and you have yourself a bog that keeps frogs fish and an amazing lotus. Their is virtually no maintenance to the whole thing once installed. At one time she had over 30 flowers all around 10 inches across no this lotus Perry D Slocum
God, that looks amazing! I have been considering where to plant a permanent lotus....
Well when I first got done she was very upset. I made her pay for the liner and she said I qote. You built me a mud hole !!!. She ate those words by the end of the first summer when it grew filling up the entire bog and flowered all summer. She has sense had me put in 3 more bogs in here yard and is talking about more.
Here is a pic of her back yard. I built the pond and waterfall. Her yard has been a testing ground for my hardy tropical breeding and hardy tropical plants. I usually give her my new hybrids to test and try out and see which ones she has luck over wintering with just adding mulch. She's good at growing plants and at times she has me jelous at what she can grow.
How beautiful! How great to have such a compliant guinea pig ; )
What zone are you?
I am a zone 6 Louisville KY. We usually get around 0F
Oops-
snapple45, I just realized that you were (very rightly) complimenting bwilliams. I feel so stupid!
A good lesson in paying better attention. (I was wondering how anyone could be so impressed by my scraggly lotus.)
Plantaholic186 - scraggly is what mine was. Did you notice I didn't post a pic of mine? ;)
FINALLY!
This one I filed down until I had a rather large white dot. Only 3 days to germinate.
Unfortunatly this is usually the time I lose the seedlings. It is hard this time of the year to provide the heat and light they require to become healthy. Much like other aquatics they love the hot water and bright sun. If you can provide that they move really fast if not they tend to get stingy and the leaves will brown. They are really easy to sprout in a aquarium and you can keep a good eye on them their with out having to do regular water changes. As soon as they have one to two leaves though they should be moved out in to full sun warm weather.
When should I add aquatic soil to the water?
I'm just so excited to finally get one to germinate!
I plan on keeping it on a heat mat under grow lights as long as possible. We'll see.
Wow! Bwilliams... those lotus and gardens are amazing! I'm trying a lotus in my pond for the first time this year, bought it from the water lily coop, they are shipping it and my lilies at the end of the month. I hope I have success... we certainly have sunny and hot here!
Just thinking about what you've said here, bwilliams, you don't put the lotus in any kind of container? Our ponds are pretty large (and quite deep, about 3 1/2 feet). How should I anchor the lotus without a container? Can I get some sort of solid type clay? Thanks in advance...
Brenda
Well a lotus is like a underwater vine it will crawl and spread easily and can take over a pond if not contained. In the bog it is allowed to spread and expand that is why I have been able to get such large leaves and a lot more blooms. It's a bit more natural for the lotus. If you have a huge pond I do think they are worth putting them in. Their are a few things that can be done. One is with really large ponds you can build a underwater wall you can use large rocks or cendar blocks some thing that will hold the dirt back and give the lotus plenty of room. Then plant your lotus their. If the pond is big but not extemely large huge containers can be bought that will hold a lotus I would suggest something barrel size or larger it does not have to be deep but it does need to be wide. The lotus plant need 4 to 12 inches of water over the top of the container. The deeper they are the more surface leaves you will get the more shallow the more leaves you will get held up out of the water. Also if you have it in the container do not fill the contain to the top with soil leave around 4 to 5 inches on top this will keep the vines spreading around the pot rather than taking off into the pond.
This photo of the large pond at St Louis Botanical gardens shows a lotus bog similar to what I talked about first. Their is a underwater barrier that holds the soil and the lotus back. I am sure that it has to be maintained every year or two to keep them from over taking the area.
Thanks for all the detailed info! Now we're thinking that maybe we'll make a separate bog area for it, as it may be just too disruptive to the pond. So, there is a new project for us. We might even have some pond liner left over from when we built the pond. What is growing around the base of the bog? (Outside edge)... it's very pretty.
Brenda
Here is another pic of the same batch of lotus from the other side. I was about to get a good luck of a cement retaining wall that was build out form the edge of the pond you can see it in the first pic on the edge of the pond it contained the lotus plants and held them back. I am sure they have to have someone go out and cut all the runners off each year to keep it from spreading to far from it's space.
"B"-your are an awe inspiring gardener! Forget your Mom-her garden is perfect already . . . Come and visit me and I'll adopt you and we can do some serious gardening together! LOL!
Seriously, You are very talented-thanks for sharing your pic's. What does your garden look like?
Linda
How long did it take for you to reach the white area of the seed with filing? My seed is like a stone. I even tried cutting into it with my new bread knife from Christmas. I get a little bit of the shell off but it is still not white. Also, have any of you ever tried putting a plant heater/germinator underneath the lotus seed to see if it would speed up the process? I'm going to try that, if I can ever get the coating off.
Take a regular file for sharpening tools and I usually use the edge which will make a fast scape into the seed. You should see some white very soon the coating is only about as thick as a finger nail.
Sharpening tools-are we supposed to sharpen our tools????? I seriously don't do that but maybe because my husband seems to break my tools within a few years of buying them and I take the pieces back to Sears (lovely Craftsman brand) and get my free replacement. I'll have to go there and get a file and some instructions. BTW, how often am I supposed to file the tools? I feel like a fool . . .
LOL It all depends on how often they are being used. It seems for us here were it is out job we have to sharpen tools every 2 to 4 weeks. It is the difference between a sore back.
Okay, I do a ton of digging so I have to look into sharpening the tools. Just one more lousy job to add to the already busy gardening list and it doesn't have anything to do with the fun part (the actual planting . . .)!
Linda
We have a grinding wheel for most of our tools. A file is good for sharpening trimmers or smaller tools with tight blades. I use mine now more for seeds than anything.
Grinding wheel sounds like an accident waiting to happen in our house. My husband isn't handy and everything is usually outsourced in our home. I will probably have to have my handyman teach me about sharpening my tools and the pros and cons of a file versus a grinding wheel.
MM have you tried just a nail file?
A finger nail file.
This message was edited Jan 4, 2009 4:45 PM
To nick the seed coat on the lotus you could use a hand held dremel with a grinding wheel or even grind back and forth on a cinder block and or concrete pavement. It is really important to get that white spot showing. Does not have to be very big of a spot, just enough to allow water to penetrate. It may take a few minutes depending on how strong you are because that seed coat is pretty tough.
If you have a heat mat go ahead and use it. All seeds seem to like it warm to germinate and sprout.
A serrated knife can work I would recommend it if starting just a handful of seeds. The smaller the grooves in the knife the better and least likely you will cut yourself. A nail file can work but it seems to take a long time to get through the seeds.
Linda,
Google 'rasp'. This will bring up different sites, but about 1/3 of the way down the page, you will see pictures. I used this on my lotus seeds when I did mine and it took no time at all. I did 6 seeds without any problems.
Carolyn
I used a steak knife and the outer shell is softening up. I did work with the nail file but I will be in a retirement home at that speed and still without a lotus plant . . .
LOL are you done yet?
I am done! The other casing is soft and full from the water-no plant emerging as of yet. I got the seed from a lotus in a Christmas dried flower display that was painted. It may not work as I have no idea how old the seed is or if the paint on the outside could have done anything tot he inside of the seed.
Regarding 'rasp'-I looked that word up online and saw it and read through the articles and saw mention of dremels (which I own one) and in the future I will use that for those hard shelled seed coverings.
I just scraped mine back and forth on the cement blocks outside...(Using pliers to not scrape my knucles) and it worked just fine! CHANGE the water every day or so.