I would love to give my seeds a head start, but I'm afraid that the house is too cold (~52) to do it. I have lights, but obviously they can't be on 24/7. Bottom heat is wrong (after germination), I know, but could I put the heating pad behind them, so it just warms them? I have a spot in my laundry room, which gets more heat then the rest of the house, but it sure isn't consistent *g*.
Any thoughts would be welcome. So many seeds, and not a clue what to do with them....
Starting seed in cold house?
For many seeds your house is too warm, although you can get a start on them soon...
Why not wait a few weeks when temps warm up? You can start with bottom heat and then move to your laundry area or a window. If that won't work you may be better off waiting until you can start them directly outside. The winter sowing forum has a lot of information about starting seeds outside in cooler temps.
I do not start anything at all indoors anymore. I winter and spring sow everything and my plants are beautiful, strong and much more weather resistant than my indoor started plants ever were.
The problem with your cool house will be that you can germinate your plants and many will do fine after sprouting in those cool temps, but some will just stagnate because many veg. need a good 60 or higher to get going.
GGG
Hi catmad - I have had really great luck with bottom heat - even hard-to-sprout seeds like parsley come up in no time. Here's my set up:
I have a metal "baker's rack" which has nice wide shelves made of perforated metal. (You could make a shelf by stapling "hardware cloth" to a wood frame.) I plant my seeds in flats in which the soil is only about 2" deep. I water very well and cover the soil with plastic to keep in the moisture. The flats go on the shelf and one or two lamps (without their shades) go underneath so the lightbulbs are, maybe, 6" from the bottom of the flats. This seems to allow about the right amount of heat to reach the seeds.
Some things you might try: get the Seed Starters Handbook or some other source which will tell you exactly what temperature various seeds sprout the best. (For example, tomatoes like a lot of heat, cabbage doesn't.) Keep a small thermometer on top of the plastic covering the flats so you can monitor the temperature. Move the flat or lights around to get the best heat. Watch out for drying - the heat may dry out the soil quickly. Once the seeds sprout they should immediately go under florescent lights placed an inch or so above the plants so you get good strong seedlings. Small plants like herbs, parsley, spinach and the like can stay in the shallow flats until transplanted. Larger plants like tomatoes or squash should be transplanted from the flat to a deeper container - like 3 or 4" flowerpots.
Well, as you can tell I could go on and on! So I'll shut up and wish you luck!
Oh - make sure the flats are completely water-proof - you do not want water dripping on your lamps!
Well, I just went and checked, and the temp is 45, so I'll have to wait, for sure. Thanks GGG, that's what I'd figured. Since my indoor tomato starts were a disaster last year, maybe I will just wait.
CompostR, thanks, very good directions :). The problem tho, is not getting them started, it's keeping them growing. I was worried that when the lights went out at night, it would be too cold. Looks as if I'm right, so I'll have to wait.
Appreciate the help from both of you :))
You could use a red infrared lamp at night - be sure it's not too close as it get pretty hot.
This message was edited Jan 28, 2008 1:03 PM
CompostR, I was thinking of using an infrared light but wondered how close it could/should be to the soil with the seeds. I have a Metro shelf unit I could use outdoors. If I covered the flats with plastic wrap, is there a danger of the heat melting it? Or is this where the thermometer comes in? ;)
I haven't actually tried the heat lamp on seeds because we keep the house in the 60's degree wise. But I did use one on my baby chicks a while back and it had to be several feet away - it's that hot. Melting the plastic - yikes! then you're probably cooking your seeds : o
Great info CompostR. I hadn't thought about the bare bulb treatment. I think that will give me just the little extra push I need!
Great thread!
I'm a little confused here (but that is normal for me!) *grin
Catmad, you said in your first post "I would love to give my seeds a head start, but I'm afraid that the house is too cold (~52) to do it." Then GGG says, "For many seeds your house is too warm, although you can get a start on them soon..."
Depending on the seeds you are wishing to start will certainly make a difference on the air and soil temps...52º is not too warm at all for some, is too chilly for others.
The infrared light mentioned above might be overkill as a couple of standard fluorescent lights will provide enough heat if they are boxed in and allowing the heat to rise directly up to your flats. (There is a great thread on DG showing you how to make a nice inexpensive heat box if you are interested in making one.)
Regarding your tomato seeds, a good germination temp is around 70º for a quick germination. 75º would be good as well but I'd suggest keeping it below that. And remember, although tomatoes can germinate as low as 65º they will take much longer to do so and the threat of seed rot is greater. Once tomatoes are up though you are better off if they continue to grow at a cooler temp, preferably 60-65. (If you are germinating pepper seeds, do your best to keep the temps at least 75º and even as high as 80º...they really need the heat for quick germination.)
Hope this helps you get you plants up and growing!
Best of all to you and yours!
Shoe
Thanks Shoe, it's tomatoes I'm looking for, I have an inordinate number of varieties, and for some reason I keep buying more. I now have one part of the house heated to 58, will the tomatoes still grow? I do have "bottom heat" to get them going, so that shouldn't be a problem. I will accidently bump the thermostat if need be....gotta be cheaper than buying the amount of plants I need, if I could even find them. I'll wait on the peppers, I'm not nearly so desperate for fresh peppers :)
Thanks! I'm going to fill my table with seed packs today, and see where I go from here...
Tomatoes are happiest when nightime (coolest) temps are above 55. Below that and they will just sit there and wait for warmth. As for high (daytime) temps, I really don't know what is ideal. They do need a lot of light!
"it's tomatoes I'm looking for, I have an inordinate number of varieties, and for some reason I keep buying more."
Hah!, Boy-howdy, don't we all know that feeling, Catmad! :>)
As for tomatoes, they don't necessarily rely on bottom heat to germ but if that is your source of heat that'll sure work. Top of the fridge will work, too, as will the top of a water heater. I used to start several flats of seeds in our oven; I could turn on the oven light and it would heat the oven up perfectly for germinating seeds. (Although it is a gas oven it was the kind that didn't keep a pilot light burning so can't tell you if yours is like that or if that would be a good idea.)
And ditto what CompostR says, don't let your plants get below 55º at night. Preferably they'll do best growing at a nighttime temp of 60-70 with 65 being optimum. (This is referring to air temperature.)
Ya'll are making me want to start my seeds too early! Guess I'll start cooler weather crops tomorrow to hold me over! (Lettuce, onions, broc, cabbage, etc).
Shoe
Lucky you Shoe! I have to wait 'till mid-march up here. I'm just about going crazy!
CompostR..welp, hate to tease ya, er, I mean TELL ya, but I got dirt under my nails today and sowed a 100 or so tomato seeds in some row flats in the g-house. Figured I'd get some up and going and grow some in some potting mix bags in my g-house in an effort to get an early crop of maters. (The extra plants I'll pot up, then repot into gallon pots for sales at the farmers' market.)
Tomorrow will sow lettuce seeds, maybe some onions as they should be fine in an unheated g-house for quite a while.
Thinking of all ya'll up North and counting down the days till you can get started.
Happy Gardening to all!
Shoe
i felt the top of my refridgerator and it does not feel warm--is it supposed to be warmer? and if warm is good for germination is it ok if it is dark? i have water heater closets that are warmer but dark--i know that once the seed sprouts it needs light but can it sprout with heat and no light? talking tomatos here
I just did mine on top of the refrigerator--heat but no light--they did fine. Once you see any signs of sprouting, though, take them down and get them into the light ASAP. Your water heater closet should be fine without light if you think they should be warmer, but again, as soon as you see them start to take off, bring them out. They won't need the extra heat by then, but they will need the light.
ditto what t-jill says. Dark is fine but get 'em to light when they declare.
planolinda, with some fridge's the heat comes from the back and rises up over the top. If your fridge is where it has a cabinet over it then that will help the hot air to flow over your seed tray(s).
Shoe
thank you jill and shoe--i understand now about the fridge because i read others saying the same thing and so thought that when i felt up on top it would be warm to the touch--now i understand about the warm air--and also good to know the water heater closet might be a good spot! it is warm, dark and dry because a pilot light and the hot water of course--just have to remember they are in there--out of sight.....
once i put picked flowers in it to dry them and forgot--it worked but i didn't find them till wayyyyyyyy later!