I had a strange phone call this evening, telling me that if I use coffee grounds for more than a year that it will ruin my soil! Guess it's suppose to sour the soil...I 've been using them in my composter along with puting them on my beds this fall...
Anyone heard of this being bad ??????????????
too much coffee grounds will ruin your soil?
you could test your soil pH
how do the plants look?
consider the source- of the phone call- ?
The coffee grounds tend to be acidic. If composted it should'nt be a problem. I wish I had a load of them.
I'd be interested in hearing their source.
I will say, however, that I don't grow anything in straight coffee grounds.... but heck, I'd try it!
Actually, Dean, I've been told once the beans have been ground and used, they're pretty close to neutral. Most of the acidity ends up in the coffee (no new news to most coffee drinkers!).
I've been collecting coffee grind a 5-gallon bucket of coffee grinds from our coffee bar at work on the average of every 1.5 weeks, and adding them to my compost bin, along with the veggie scraps. I layer shredder paper, cut grass, cut leaves, then pull a trench down the middle and toss in the decaying scraps and some coffee grinds and the filters. Fold the trench back in. I started throwing the few scrawny worms I'd find in the yard onto the pile. About 3 months ago, I could not get a pitchfork full of compost without picking up at least 30-40 worms per scoop! And I'm talking about 4-5" long and fat, fat, fat! Beauties.
I have one small flowerbed that is almost complety filled with this compost and the coffee grinds. Don't even need anything to dig a whole, except my hands. Have ferns, hostas, Easter lilies, and two mexican heathers, and a conflower plant in there. They LOVE the soil!
Too much coffee? Nah....
P.S. Dean_W, let me know next time you're coming through Houston, and I'll have a 5-gallon bucket ready for you!
Heres a link about coffee grounds... http://www.dirtdoctor.com/view_question.php?id=426
Haha!!! I'll take you up on that offer.
hey someboy's kid need a science fair project- please grow something in grounds and report back to us
but i think Gymgirl' testimony is enough
This message was edited Oct 18, 2007 7:20 PM
OK, that is surely the Worst Crank Call Ever.
Once the coffee is brewed, the grounds are close to ph neutral
ALL compost, once "finished" is PH neutral
Acidity is actually beneficial for many common garden plants, so even if there were a slight acidity to the resulting compost, I doubt it would be a problem
I don't even bother to compost the grounds first in some cases. We get 25 lbs a day from starbucks, and this time of year I layer it directly on the roses & irises -- by spring it will bea beautifully finished, and there are trace amts of sulphur which is important for the roses when they break bud in the spring.
Along that same line - I have used them in my orchard, in particular for the Blueberries I grow.My soil is already more on the acid side. I do test my soil & have not found it to be more acidic due to the coffee grounds. Like Gymgirl, it keeps the soil fluffy, & the worms fat & happy.
I also make my winter piles as she described - it breaks down nicely in my climate & is ready the following spring.
I don't understand why someone would make a phone call like this, or what the purpose was.(?)
Boy, I'm glad you all are putting my mind to ease....
If your plants or worms get the jitters, switch to decaf grounds. Othewise your gardens should be fine. :)
ROFL, garden_mermaid! I've been doing organic gardening for over 25 years and I use all the coffee grounds I can get my hands on. I can tell you that's baloney! I'm afraid to try decaf, the worms might go on strike! LOL
My worms have full time all you can eat permission.....and they do indeed love their coffee highs.
The worms grow and increase in size and number. Why last week one day a huge night walker stuck his head up and caused me to trip and fall face first into mother earth.
Aaaah! The visual!
Hey doc, do you write creative fiction by any chance???? ROFLMAO!!!!
.....and *how* big was that nightcrawler, doc?
Have to agree with "Green Jay" even if we only have "Stellar's Jays" around here and they are the darkest blue you ever saw! "Prank Call"?- more like "stupid call" to me. I, too, collect 5 gallon buckets from any place of business that I can talk into saving them for me.
Hey Guys,
I have a friend who has two very small flowerbeds in the shady walkway leading up to her front door (they're on either side of the walkway up to the house, and have walls of the house behind them.
They're in rough shape, and I'm volunteering to help her get them ready for the Springtime. Unfortunately, there's not enough time to get them ready BEFORE the Springtime (at least I don't think so, in my limited experience as a newbie gardener).
Anyway, I've got 5-gallon buckets of coffee grinds available, and I'm thinking this formula. Let me know what ya'll think:
I told her to start dumping all her grass and leaf clippings into the beds now. I'll introduce some table scraps and some worms into the beds, as well as the coffee grinds. In essence, I'm thinking of creating two small mini-compost piles right there in these beds over the winter. If she waters periodically on the remaining warm days before winter sets in, it should give the stuff a chance to break down. But will it break down fast enough before March?
Should I forego adding any worms and just do the layering of grass/leaves and use the dogfood to speed up heat and a breakdown?
PLEASE ADVISE, SOONEST.
Thanks!
P.S. It's been fun reading this thread!
Gymgirl, start doing what you suggested, SOONEST, what doesn't break down now, will continue to break down when it warms up again. I advise keeping it from drying out, but don't drown it and cover with a layer of straw to a depth of 8 to 10 inches to keep from drying out and keep the temperature from fluctuating day in an day out. You know that worms will go deeper to avoid freezing and come back up to do their wonder work at warmer times of the day or week or month. If you think the wind will be a problem, put some screen or fencing over it and peg it down somehow.
Carol
How big was that worm? Well I don't rightly know because:
1. I was to busy ducking the jays headed for
the safety of the neighbors yard.
2. Then three robins fainted at the sight.
3. I was still picking bacteria out of my face.
4. No one else saw the worm of all worms.
At least it was not UFO lest I be labeled a nut. Gardening can sometimes be fun.
I forgot to say, add the worms and forget the dogfood.
Grass clippings and grounds will break down really fast. and I would only use chopped leaves.
Thanks, Guys, this really helps. After I posted this, I kept reading and found an old (2004-2006) lasagna bed thread. I read some of that, too. Should I go for that type of layering in the beds? The only difference between that and what I proposed is they start out with the coffee grinds, then do that ayer of cardboard, then newpaper. What does this do for the whole process? I could easily do this same thing. Just trying to understand what the cardboard and newspaper do.
Could somebody tell me? Thanks. I'll be sure to tell her to start chopping up her leaves. I think she has one of those mowers that will chop stuff up. And I already have some extra bags of decaying leaves, too. Got them from my neighbor. DH complained about all the bags, but I knew what I was doing! He didn't.
Thanks, guys!
Linda
Cardboard and newspaper are of course made from trees and will biodegrade. They can also wick away moisture if not completely soaked. They are the "brown" of the "brown, green, brown, green" (cold, hot, cold hot)(carb, nitrogen, carb, nitrogen) layers of your lasagna. Cardboard might be suspect if you don't know what kind of glue or type of reused paper is used in it. On the good side cardboard introduces more air into the mixture which is good. (Fluffy oxygenated compost is good) The "green" is the hot nitrogen part: grass clippings, manure, sprinkles of "Heaven Forbid!" ammonium nitrate or ammonium sulphate, which are just fertilizers used by large farms. The Brown is the cardbord, leaves, newspaper, straw, twigs, plant/garden waste from the year. Layering these with a sprinkling of soil, compost (good worm livable stuff, with the worms still in it) with a good sprinkling of water between each layer and there you are! Keep it moist, covered with straw and come springtime you wil be able to reach your hand into this compost right down to the root level of..... what were you going to plant, that will be the envy of the block?
The cardboard and paper are for weed or grass suppression in the bed. If converting a part of lawn to a planting bed you place the cardboard on or near the bottom of the pile and it will smother out the grass so it doesn't need to be removed first. It will also smother weeds and conserve soil moisture.
Karen
Karen, I agree if she was starting with lawn or other unplanted weedy area, but she stated that "She had two very small flowerbeds in the shady walkway leading up to her front door (they're on either side of the walkway up to the house)." So, starting with (presumaby) preexisting garden beds, a layer of newspaper or cardboard may inhibit the worms and other microbial fauna's rise to the to-be composted material above it. Only in the case of very weed infested beds would the cardboard and paper be the most benificial tactic.
Carol
No, no..not true ceeadsalaskazone3! Worms love newspaper and cardboard. Although it takes longer for the cardboard to break down. Just be careful about which cardboard you pick, some of them are waxed and don't break down as easily. Use the black and white sections of the newspaper, not the colored ads. Gymgirl, you're basically doing sheet composting in that area. Google for more info, if you need too, but it sounds like you got the "basics" working just fine. As long as you bury the veggie leavings, that way no danger of odor, by spring those beds should be ready to "jump".
Ok, you guys I'll go along with you if no waxed cardboard. We have lots of waxed cardboard in Seward, for shipping frozen seafood. They use it inside a close fitting styrofoam container and ship frozen delicacys all over the world.
Carol
I can understand that one, wax as a water repellent which is not what we composters are looking for. LOL I was thinking of big appliance boxes. Sometimes I go mooch those for a new bed, to kill the grass and weeds out, always wet the area first and then put down the cardboard and then I just keep piling good stuff on top. We have a friend of a friend that delivers newspapers, so I got all the newspaper I can use. I use those too in layers over the cardboard wetted down.
Years ago, my Mother in Law tried to kill some hedges by putting her coffee grounds on them every day (she used to make 3-4 pots per day) Let me tell you those hedges were huge and full and the soil was great in comparison to the rest of the clay soil surrounding them!
Hi gang! Started my first lasagna bed this past weekend. It's small - 4 feet by 2 feet and about 12"-18" high. I started with coffee grounds, then a layered of wet newspaper, then a layer of wet peat moss, then a layer manure/humus mix, added a layer of green plant stuff, sprinkled with more peat and threw on a layer of chopped leaves. (I showered each layer with water).
Do I need to make the top layer a green (like more manure/humus mixed with some soil or compost)?
Should I add anything to help it heat up?
Most lasagna won't heat up simply because of inadequate depth, but it's not supposed to. It is a form of cold composting. That it why you can plant in it right away.
I prefer cardboard over newspaper, but that's just personal preference. Either will work. I use corrugated cardboard if it's available but I'll use the thin shiny kind too. Bud Light boxes line plenty of my beds. I don't WANT it to rot fast because it performs many functions and does them well. Paper or cardboard will smother any weeds or grass present and impede later emergence, and prevent drying of the soil. It promotes conditions worms prefer- moist and dark- and mitigates extreme temperatures as well. It seems to me that many on this forum over emphasize the presence of worms in the composting process. They really play their role late in the game. Bacteria and fungi have to do their thing first, then nematodes, arthropods and many other organisms. The worms come when conditions are favorable for them. There's a good book, if anyone is interested, on just what worms do for us.
http://www.amazon.com/Earth-Moved-Remarkable-Achievements-Earthworms/dp/product-description/1565123379
Another I have read and highly recommend is Teaming With Microbes
http://www.amazon.com/Teaming-Microbes-Gardeners-Guide-Soil/dp/0881927775/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1195156788&sr=1-1
Karen
I'm backing out of this discussion. I live in Alaska and don't have a leg to stand on when it comes to composting in the lower 48.
Michaeljo, what's your temperature right now?
Doccat5, I would ask you the same
But, Want2bee, your temperature and your lows and highs are what matter. If you have temps in the 60's or 70's right now, you may have a chance to get a little action started at this time and depending on the duration and depth of the freeze you have this winter, you have a jump start on next spring.
I may be the "Compost Queen" in Seward, Alaska, but I do my composting as soon as everything thaws in late March or early June and do my piles as fast as I can (in a week or 2) and can get my temps up to 152F when I do it just right. (My piles are chest high)
Carol
Carol: many people in the lower 48 do hot composting in winter, just not in lasagna. In any season, even in the south in summer, lasagna is not supposed to get hot, it's just a shallow pile, cold sheet composting.
In winter I might as well be in Alaska; I don't go near my compost. I just hate the cold. My efforts resume in spring. I recently spread all my finished compost. The half done stuff is in one bin with the remnants of fall cleanup, where it can just sit and sleep all winter. My other bin is stuffed completely with fall leaves, waiting for my composting to resume early next spring. I will also have three 32 gallon garbage cans of mulched leaves. Any I collect over that amount will have to go into construction bags.
It is possible to have hot compost anywhere anytime supposedly, though it would never be me trying in a cold winter climate. Apparently many people do though. The source of heat is microbial activity, not outside temperature.
Karen
Ok, now I get the cold composting part - my lasagna bed is not suppose to heat up. I guess my real questions is, given the layers I have (newspaper, peat moss, manure/humus mix, green plant stuff, and the last layer is shredded leaves), if I were to plant something in it would it grow or do I need a top layer of manure, soil, compost mix to plant in? Or am I totally confused about lasagna gardening?
ceeadsalaskazone3, it was 58 degrees here today and raining to beat the band. We're not dealing with your sub zero temps, but those that are in the northern states, ie Mn should have more info on how that works. (I went to college in MN and am orginally from NE which is no winter hot spot either) I'm slightly south of michaeljo and I think his area probably has more snow. VA is pretty temperate most of the time.
It was 65 today ... temps dropping into the mid 40's (high) with low in the low 30s for the next 5 days.
We get a few big snow falls each winter ... last year was pretty light on the snow.
kqcrna,
What steps will you take to "resume" your composting in the Spring? Do you mean you will start layering the leaves and your grass clippings
You said lasagna is just shallow pile, cold sheet composting.
So, in reviewing my process, I'm actually doing cold sheet composting, right?
If I had "heat" I'd be doing "regular" composting?
Also, gang, what do you suggest I plant in these two small flowerbeds? They really get shade because of the walls behind them. the walkway goes up the middle, and there's just a short area above the sidewalk that actually gets light. sort of a "U shape with the front door at the botton, and the two sides are where the beds are, with walls behind them.
I'd really like to do this for my friend, and plant stuff that takes minimal care, too. Suggestions are very appreciated.
Linda
In early spring, when I find the weather tolerable for me, I'll go out and flip the entire contents of the bin with a fork to aerate and adjust moisture as needed. That will probably just continue to process, and I'll start another separate new batch in another bin. I probably actually tend to the compost from about late Feb or early Mar. until Nov. or so., then it'll be on it's own for winter again. As I've said, I HATE to be cold.
And yes, lasagna is cold sheet composting, as opposed to "regular" composting.
I'm not very knowledgeable about flowers for shady areas because I have so little of it. And I sure don't know anything about gardening in Texas so I'll leave that to someone who does.
Good luck,
Karen