Fancy Hibiscus

I wasn't going to do anything, but I think for future buyers, it is important to see the difference in flowers from David, Robert, Matt and Charles, vs Winn.

I made an entry in the garden watchdog, for those of you who want to see it.
http://davesgarden.com/products/gwd/c/529/

I am also posting pics of my plants that I have had for 6 months, so you can see the quality of Fancy Hibiscus, when they have grown.

Now, if you decide to buy from there, at least you have made an educated decision.

These 3 pots are Topaz Glory, 5th Dimension and Abundant Treasure. Pretty sad looking.

This is Junes Joy and Tarantella from David. I bought these a month later, they were drowning in the floods, lightning broke off 2 major branches of Junes Joy, and yet they managed to survive, and come back to grow as beautiful plants.

These 2 pots are right next to the ones above.
All were transplanted at the same time.

This message was edited Sep 28, 2007 12:44 AM

A close up o a very poor Abundant Treasure, just starting to regain her leaves.

A close up of 5th Dimension and Topaz Glory plants.

A close up of Wallflower.

This message was edited Sep 28, 2007 12:44 AM

A Gator Pride, from Winn, that bloomed today. Keep in mind, I bought this plant 6 months ago.

sorry, pic reposted.

This message was edited Sep 27, 2007 1:35 PM

A Gator Pride, from HVH that I bought 3-1/2 months ago. This flower is 6-7" in diameter, always opens, and the bush is phenomenal. It has grown to 4 feet in 3 months!

These were the very first hibiscus I ever bought, so I had nothing to compare them to. I feel horrible showing the above. But, I just want to reiterate, that should someone buy from there, they can now make an educated purchase.

This message was edited Sep 28, 2007 12:46 AM

I think if you saw Fancy Hibiscus at a trade show you probably could buy some lovely plants. From my experience with them, I believe mail order business is their way of disposing of the ones they should have thrown in the trash.

Tussee

I wouldn't normally comment on another hibiscus grower, but Winn is a special case since I, too, bought some of my very first exotic hibiscus from Fancy Hibiscus. I was thrilled to receive the 18 varieties in my first order, but sadly by the following spring only 2 survived. In the meantime I had learned to graft since there were almost no sources for plants in the mid- 90's but wood was easy to get from enthusiastic collectors. My own first grafts were mostly doing just fine by that spring so why were Winn's dying? Since then I have heard many similar tales although by almost all accounts Winn is a nice guy and a great salesman. For years any mention of Fancy Hibiscus online brought forth many "buyer beware" comments but I never have been able to figure out what goes wrong or is wrong with too many of his plants.

Just my 2 cents,

Charles

Hi Cat

I'm sorry you had problems with Winn. He was my first provider of hibs also. I found Winn engaging and very helpful since I didn't know anything about hibs at that point. I don't even know what happened to those plants but I remember Winn very well because when I opened my business I wanted to be as accessible as Winn was.

I still have a soft spot for him (in a manly sort of way of course). I didn't buy more plants from him after that but not because of any problems. I found other providers is all.

All of those plants you have seem to be on their own roots rather than grafted. Many varieties are strong plants on their own roots but some really need to be grafted. I am thinking that your plants are languishing on their own roots. Others will tell you that if careful own roots plants will do just fine but I disagree with that. I have seen literally thousands of plants languish because they were on their own roots and that when grafted they were beautiful.

I would suggest you take a look at the roots of those plants. See if they look healthy! If not try giving them a bath of 10% bleach solution. Sometimes there just isn't anything you'll be able to do. A weak plant is a weak plant but your's look like they have an inadequate root system to me.

David

I have never bought from Fancy Hibiscus but if you look at his website there are photos of smiling people carrying off plants. The plants they are carrying look sad and thin.

David, you spoiled me for big, lush, healthy plants.

Yes, David, I have also been spoiled by you, Robert, Charles Black and Matt Martindale. Sadly, I just made my first (and last) purchase from Winn. Fortunately for me it was only three plants, and all are quite awful - if any of them live it will be a miracle. I always hesitate to say bad things - I would far rather positively comment, but after speaking with Cat through Dmail about both of our experiences, I will also post in the Garden Watchdog so others don't waste their money like I just did. From now on, I'm only sticking to my own personal "approved vendor list" ;-)

karen

Hi David,
These plants were indeed grafted. If not, then I was lied to when I bought them....in person.
That is not to say that Winn is not a nice person, he is. He is also extremely knowledgable. However, these plants have pretty much always looked like this and they have not improved. I did look at the roots, when I transplanted. But, will do so again, tomorrow, on your suggestion.
I also have 2, which I did not post, that have not grown a single inch in 6 months, not a drop.
With you, Robert, Charles or Matt, I have 100% faith, that my hibs will be beautiful and healthy.
If I could, I would delete this thread, but I don't know how to do that.
My intention is not to make this public knowledge, but to only those who are part of this forum.

This message was edited Sep 28, 2007 12:48 AM

Hey no worries Cat. That's what Garden Watchdog is supposed to be all about...customers, sharing their experiences.

As far as grafted..well, they don't look grafted but perhaps the graft is under the soil line?

David

Back inthe 70's when I would visit South Florida there would be hibiscus growers all over the place, everyone and their brother were growing and selling them. DH hated it because I would make him pull off the road so I could look at all the pretty plants every few minutes. LOL
A lot of advances have been made in the horticulture field and with newer growing techniques and hybridization you get nicer plants. It just looks to me, only from the pictures and his website, that Winn is still growing in the 70's mode. He certainly has an outstanding variety of material however.

Good points, Ardesia. There have been a lot of changes and improvements in both plants and techniques made in the last 10 years. I know that I learn new things with every crop and use them with the next crops. We have yet to find a perfect hibiscus, but we do have some good ones now and the search for improvements continues.

Some growers put their efforts more into public relations and some more into learning their craft. Seems like both ways pay off but nothing beats cultivars with good genes, propagated with care into new plants and given a good healthy start before shipping. There is a lot that goes into each step in order to produce these marvelous beauties. Remember, if we didn't do it they would cease to exist in just a few decades.

There is a neat symbiosis here between hibiscus and people now. Apparently the original natural pollinators of hibiscus are either extinct or do not live where most Hibiscus rosa-sinensis are grown. It is a very rare exception to find a hibiscus pod with viable seeds that was not hand pollinated. With the possible exception of some of the Hawaiian species all other hibiscus r-s are propagated by people and without that there would be no new hibiscus. Sort of an awesome idea/responsibility, yes?

Charles

Charles

Att. David or Charles

I need an answer. If I take a cutting of one of my tropical hibiscus and root it, it won't be as good of a plant as one that has been grafted. It would be leggy and a slow grower.

I'll let David or Charles give you the real answer, but from one of David's earlier posts, it sounds like some varieties will grow well on their own roots but others won't, so if there are particular cultivars you were thinking of doing cuttings of I'd post what they were, I'm sure they'll know whether they're ones that would do better being grafted or if they're OK on their own roots.

Yep, that's right! It depends on the variety. Root whatever varieties you want. If they take and root that's one test. Then see if the roots grow out and the cutting turns into a vigorous plant...that's the second test. One cutting of a variety is not a good test. To really know you have to produce a lot of cuttings but for enthusiasts who cares just give it a try.

The garden variety hibiscus root easily. Those are the ones you commonly get at your local big box store like Home Despot. The exotic hybrids known as cultivated varieties or cv's are the ones that can cause a problem propagating on their own roots. Some of these varieties even grafted are a huge challenge to grow. In actuality most of the cv's will root but again some of our favorites will not or will languish on a weak root system.

Much of this depends on the cuttings you are taking. Take cuttings on healthy well fed plants and your take rate will increase greatly. Also the part of the cutting you should take from is that area where the brown wood is turning to green so you are taking from that transition zone. That does not mean that wood will not root or that all green will not but your better chance is that area of brown to green.

Last suggestion: (Sorry about the long letters) Start with varieties you know root very well like the gv's. Develop a system for success then start with the cv's. There's nothing like success to give confidence and you'll know if a cv fails you lessen the chance it was because of something you did.

David

Years ago I bought some hibiscus from Fancy Hibiscus . Everyone of them died. I always thought it was me.