Too hot?

I have been lurking here trying to read and learn about Plumerias. I put up a GH earlier this year and decided I would like to grow some of these plants.

I purchased two plant with small root balls on them, and two that were just bare cuttings.

I kept them in the GH until about June. After reading more about them and visiting with SB I learned that they should be outside. Well it has been very hot here and now one of the leaves looks "burnt" to me.

I am going to include a few pictures so you can see how they are progressing. I think the plants are doing very well. I had inflos on two of them when they arrived. One was on a plant that had a small root, and the other was just a bare cutting. They flowered very nicely, but I have not seen any sign of any more inflos. Will they only flower once a year? Or will they maybe still flower some more this year?

I think they were staying too wet while in the GH, as they got a lot of overspray from the overhead misters. I am watering only about once or twice a week, as I was told if I watered too much all they would do is grow leaves. If I am not doing this right please let me know. I also have fertilized with a 50/50 mix of Color Burst and Dynomite. (sp) About every 3 weeks or so. Maybe too much though. I think I put about a cup full on each plant.

I was going to keep them in the GH over the winter, but I don't think I will have room, so am planning on keeping them in the garage with a small electric heater to be sure they don't get too cold.

Thanks for any suggestions you may have for me.

Nautical

This is what the plants look like. You can see lots of new growth.

This is another view.

This is the Axtec Gold that was blooming when I got the plant, and continued to bloom for about a month. How long to they normally bloom?

Thanks again for any suggestions or comments.


Nautical

Nautical, you were told wrong. That is leaf burn from either too much fertilizer or lack of water or both. I water every day in the summer. Plumerias love water as long as there is good drainage. They should be in full sun. You can just pull off any leaf that looks like that.

Flowering has nothing to do with water and everything to do with energy and fertilizer. If your plumies already flowered this year, they will put on growth after they finish flowering. Sometimes you can get inflo's on the new growth late in the season, but chances are good that you will have inflo's next year. Plumerias flower from spring to fall, usually on one or more inflo. As old flowers fade, new buds open. This goes on for months usually with more mature trees.

A cup full of slow-release fertilizer sounds like too much. What do the directions say? A tablespoon is probably more the right amount, mixed in to the soil when planting. A water-soluable fertilizer is what you should be using right now. Please see the section of the FAQ's on fertilizer.

Make sure your garage floor doesn't get too cold. It shouldn't drop below 50. Plumerias are susceptible to root rot in the winter when not kept in a greenhouse.

This message was edited Aug 11, 2007 4:19 PM

Nautical-I am not sure what kind of fertilizer is Colorburst? Is it a liquid or granular? Dynamite is a slow release granular that should be applied at a rate of 1 tablespoon per gallon per whatever time release it says on the bag (i.e 4 month, 6 month etc) It is made to last that long-so applying it every 3 weeks is way too soon. If the temps are high and the plant is getting lots of water, then the fert may just last a month less than what it says ( 3- 3.5 months instead of 4 etc). But you also don't want to apply a slow release right before the temps go down and the plant is going into dormancy either.
I use Multicote-which is very similar to Dynamite, and thats it-no liquid fert with it.
I would also remove the gravel that it looks like you have on top, so you can see better when the soil needs watering. With those size plants, and in full sun, I bet that the rootballs are sizeable enough to be using all the water you give it each am-I know mine are, so you should probably water each am.
I am not seeing the burned/stressed leaves on the plants-are there many of them? Fertilizer/chemical burn on leaves usually starts on the outside of the leave and works itself inward towards the midrib-which is not happening with your leaf-so it could be water stress related. I would definitely stop any more fertilizing though
I think overall, your plumerias look great!

Thanks Clare and TL.

Clare: I am sure I must have mis-understood what I was told. I have looked back at some of my earlier e-mail and now I think they were talking about not watering in the winter when the plant goes dormant. There is SO much to read and learn. I think I also have confused myself about the fertilizer. I just read all the posts you recommneded. I had read a lot of that already, but just did not comprehend it all. There was some talk about having healthy plants and no blooms, but I think it was from too much N and not enough of the P for blooms. I will not fertilize anymore for at least a month. I will move them to a spot where they will be watered every morning.

I will but them on some kind of wood frame to get them up a few inches off of the concrete floor if that will help. I did not measure how cold it got in the garage last winter. It is an attached garage, and the dryer vent dis-charges out there. Our hibiscus and quite a few other plants have done fine out there for 4 years now. If I see the temp. dipping, I will add more heat.

TL: I will remove the gravel tomorrow. I think I got that idea from the Plumeria 101 site.

There was only one leaf that looked burned like that, and it was facing south. I thought the hot sum did it, but I am sure it is because I have not watered enough and fertilized too much.

I did have some rust on some of the leaves. I took 90% of them off and disposed of them in the trash. I also sprayed with Daconil. (sp)

The Dynamite and the Color-Burst are both granular fertilizers that I think you are suppose to mix into the top inch of soil. I will have to go read the label.

I have also been using MG 10-52-10 liquid, but most of that I have been spraying on outside flower beds. Maybe too much of that too, I am 6' 4" tall, and I have to look up to see the blooms on my Canas. :)

I have put Osmocote on a lot of the plants I am trying to grow in the GH itself. And also some liquid 7-7-7 that has micro-nutrients in it.

I am loveing the GH, but I am sure I am trying to do too many things at the same time.

I would really be lost without this website. Thanks to everyone.

Nautical

Nautical, you've got it right now. Nitrogen is for growth; phosphorus and potassium for flowering. Tigerlily gave you some excellent advice about the fertilizer and the gravel. I know that Plumerias101 recommends the pea gravel, and it makes me cringe. I'm glad you'll be removing it. The gravel can burn the stem at the soil line, and it makes it hard to tell when the soil is dry and needs watering. I would definitely ease off fertilizing for a while as Tigerlily said and stop fertilizing altogether about a month or so before they come inside for the winter.

I'm sure your plumies will be fine in the garage for the winter but remember that cold/wet can be a fatal combination for root rot so that is why plumies are kept very dry in the winter when dormant. If you were to put them in your greenhouse, you could keep them growing, and they could even flower for you in the winter. I have a temporary greenhouse set up in the winter here where I put all plumerias with inflo's, and they bloom for me in the wintertime.

I agree that, overall, your plants look great! Wow, you're tall! That could come in handy when all your plumerias shoot to the moon with all you've been feeding them! I need a ladder to smell some of mine!

hi nautical - i went to socal four days and came back to leaves just like that! temps were hotter and less humidity was in the air. top it off that the soil was almost dry. the soil in the garden bed is tricky to measure sometimes. just keep it hydrated. good luck!

Thanks Tuscon, I have had a few more do the same thing. I am watering every day now as Clare suggested. But it has been really HOT here. Over 100 degrees 4 days in a row. It has been 104 -106 in our area, and that is not in the sun. No relief until Friday when it will cool to the 90's. Also I did not "plunge" them as I have seen many people here talk about. They are on concrete and I wonder just how hot that root ball is getting, and what effect it will have if it is too hot. I have not ck'd the soil temp. I guess I need to do that.

Other than that, they look great, just no flowers. Lots of new growth though, even more I think since I started watering every day.

Nautical

Nautical,
I think your leaf was wet and the sun burnt it. I've sadly seen it happen to me when I would water early and the leaves didn't dry before the sun was on them.
Mickey

Nautical, just as a side note, I wouldn't worry about how hot your root balls are getting as long as they get plenty of water. I have mine on concrete too and three-quarter rock, which is even hotter. If you have one of those Laser temperature gauges, you can check the soil temp. I have one somewhere that hubby got from Harbor Freight Tools. Anyway, GordonHawk in New York has his plumies up on his rooftop, where he has measured the temp as 145 degrees. I believe he waters twice a day!

Wow! 145 degrees is hot. I did not know what mine would be, so I checked. This is the temp close to the surface. Sorry about the reflection in the meter.

This is the temp about 9" down in the soil. I also took a measurment at the outside edge of the plastic pot, and it was 101. But close to the root ball, below the surface it was only about 85. The outside temp was 101 today, and the photo was taken around 5pm.

Now, where is Dete? This is his type of thread! Dete has recorded all sorts of pot, soil, and leaf temps there in Arizona with his temperature gauge also. He was even up measuring in the middle of the night! That is so dedicated! LOL! Detrick is very scientific and knows alot about soil temps.

Anyway, those seem like happy temperatures to me, Nautical! Root ball temps are especially important when you are trying to root cuttings in the winter or have a plumeria that is rotting. In that case, you never want to let the soil temp drop below 80. For normal healthy trees that stay outside in the winter, soil temp shouldn't drop much below 40.