Attention all Butterfliers!
I'm a first time flutter-mama but it may not be good news.:(
Between 4:30 and 5:00 this afternoon I noticed one of my 5 BST eclosed.
First eclosed BST a Failure?
Why are you saying it is not good news, Deborah?
Congrats on your first BST Butterfly!
Adam, that's his name, had crawled to the top of his cage when I discovered he had eclosed. In my excitement to open the top of the cage, he fell to the bottom, bumping sticks as he went down. Oh no, I killed him already, I thought. But, Adam climbed back up the cage....
Oh my! Did his wings ever unfurl completely?
Sorry to hear about his little "accident". :-(
So being the novice I am in this department, when a butterfly ecloses does that mean come out of its coccoon? Sorry for the dumb question but I have heard that mentioned several times and was not sure exactly what it meant. Thanks everyone.
Leslie
It gets worse...........I took a daisy bloom for him to climb out of the cage. He crawls off the daisy bloom into the tall grass below....
Yes, Lostintexas, I didn't know either until two days ago. Eclosed is to emerge from the chrystalis.
It started sprinkling rain and the wind was blowing so I get this bright idea;. I'd find something to sheild him. I find an old live (dead now) Christmas wreath to lean against the flower bed railling. It's made of natural material, right? So he climbs up the wreath. But to my dismay, I noticed the hard dried branches had torn through his wing.
Here's one of the tears in his wing.
Here it is 7:50 and he hasn't completely unfolded. I thought it only took an hour! It's all my fault for trying to be a good bf keeper. Using that hard wreath tore his wing. I'm so upset I could cry!
He's still just sitting on the same unopened daisy bud as when I left him to come in and write this post. To help scare away the birds, I tied strips of a plastic bag on the two end trellises of the flower bed. I guess I'll just have to wait and see if he's able to fly.
Should I have not taken him out of the cage before he had completely unfurled????
Please feel free to ask if you don't understand some of the butterfly terminology. We're all here to help and learn from each other :o)
eclose = emerge
butterfly / chrysalis
moth / cocoon
Egads!!! His (yes, it's a male BST) wings look like they never completely unfurled. Did they ever get fully pumped up? If so, he should still be able to fly with a torn wing...but if he is unable to fly you can try to extend his life by placing him on plants to nectar or even next to a cotton ball or small sponge soaked with gatorade. It would probably be more humane to put him down but that's extremely hard to do...well, for me anyway. I just hate the thought of killing a butterfly but he'd suffer a worse fate if left on his own. Very easy prey for spiders, lizards and birds etc.
Best thing to do when raising butterflies is to place the chrysalids in a meshed cage or have something inside the cage they can crawl onto and hang from so they can fully extend and pump up their wings.
If the weather is damp it will take longer for their wings to dry out. There is no harm in keeping a butterfly inside a cage for a day or so. I usually put in fresh blooms for it to nectar if it gets hungry/thirsty...but most won't bother with food when they first eclose.
I move the last instar caterpillars to one of the reptariums so they will crawl up the mesh to pupate. Whenever I find a chrysalis I want to raise, I clip the branch it's on and move that into one of the reptariums as well.
Remember, butterflies and moths need something to crawl onto or cling to when they eclose. A butterfly left in a plastic container or glass jar more often than not will damage it's wings when it tries to climb up and falls back down.
~ Cat
Deborah - Don't feel too bad. I've made similar mistakes when I was first learning to raise and release them. Yes, it is best to just leave them alone after they eclose. They need to hang and dry out their wings. And most usually just hang quietly without much movement for the first day after they emerge. I usually let them alone and release them the next day. By then, they are recovered from their emerging and ready to fly out into the big wide world of freedom! Hey, it's your first one and you didn't know.
Whenever I have a butterfly that can't fly for whatever reasons, I have a cage that I use just for raising them in captivity. I feed them gatorade. I put a white (unscented) kleenex tissue in a butter lid and pour a little bit of gatorade over the kleenex to let it soak through it. And then put the butterfly on it the next day after eclosing. I change the gatorade out every day. After a while the butterflies come right to the butter lid/dish to eat. I've raise more than I care to count that way. I have a hard time just leaving them to die if they have a broken or torn wing.
ps...saw your last post...if it's too late in the day it's best to move him back into a meshed cage or pop up hamper etc. Put in some styrofoam or something for him to crawl up on...butterflies like roosting under leaves or hanging upside down from twigs for the night.
~ Cat
I'm headed out the door right now to put him up for the night. Can't say enough how much I appreciate y'all telling me all of this. I've been wringing my hands for the last three hours.
Deborah
Deborah - If you want your neighbors to really think you've gone over the deep end ..... take your butterfly out gardening with you. I take mine out and put it on a nectar plant close by (so I can keep an eye on it). And then do my gardening while it gets to sip nectar. LOL! I've had them on my shirt, on my shoulder, on my hand, etc. carrying them around with me in the yard. One of my neighbors chuckles every time he see me with a butterfly. He knows it is one of my "pets". LOL! The neighbors have heard my speech about pesticides and caring for our environment and all the creatures in it. I don't like killing anything. They think I am a throwback from the 60's with all the peace/love/one-with-nature ideals. LOL! And yes! I did grow up in the 60's! But that's not why I feel that way, I just have a deep respect for "most" of God's creatures!
I know my neighbors don't know what in the world to think of me. I probably give them something to talk about when I am not around. None of them have flowers in their yards. Just grass and shrubs and trees. No blooms. NO color except green. Ugh!
So ..... you may have a new "pet" if your BST can't fly tomorrow. They only live about 2-3 weeks as butterflies. In captivity they usually live longer than in the wild because they don't have predators trying to eat them or wind up on someone's windshield. So it's not all bad. :-)
Awww, I've had it happen too. Sometimes their wings are deformed and won't fully open. I have fed them Gatorade and some have lived over 2 weeks in my bf pavilion. I know it's heartwrenching.
I have a question that I'm ashamed to ask but here goes......When the others in the cage elcose, is it possible for Adam to mate with his sister?
Cat, how can you tell Adam is a male? I just took a wild guess and gave it a name beginning with the first letter of the alphabet.
Can someone recommend a good bf book with pictures of both male and female North American species?
oh so sorry Deborah. We always feel so bad when something goes wrong when we are only trying to help.
Deborah - I mated butterflies before that were related. You can do it with one generation, but any more would probably produce babies with deformities. I've never mated BST in captivity, but Monarchs do adapt quite well. I raised 18 Monarch butterflies in a cage at one time due to very cold weather conditions. I knew if I released them in February of that year they would've died from the cold and lack of nectar food. They all lived about 3 weeks and several did mate. There are some tricks I learned about in the "Family Butterfly Book" about getting them to mate. But that was for the Monarchs, not the BST butterflies. I have heard that the BST are harder to raise than Monarchs. Apparently the BST need to fly more than the Monarchs. Monarchs spend more time perching than actually flying. Whereas I believe BST do more flight and less perching.
Thank you Donna, I read something that really stuck with me, I think Debnes said something like...it's better to have a 50% survival rate than the 2% rate they probably would have if we did nothing at all. My husband's gone to the store right this minute buying a bottle of Gatorade. If his wings don't unfurl, I'll feed him in a cage.
Thank you Becky. That's good to know about related first generation mating. I tell ya, I'm so unfamiliar with the insect world. Sure is enjoyable learning though. I say, "I didn't know that!", several times a day after reading posts on Dave's.
That is absolutely true, Deborah! It's your first one and it's a disappointment when things don't go right. {{{hugs}}} But they are still better off (in my humble opinion) when we help them. More make it with our help. They seem to be at the bottom of the food chain. They have so many predators ... wasps, ants, birds, preying mantis, plus the additional threat of pesticides, etc.Their survival rate is very low in the wild. Most don't make it to the Butterfly stage. You did good trying to help and I am sure the others will be fine when they eclose. That's so sweet that your dh ran to get some gatorade. Stay with the same flavor gatorade as they don't like to change other than nectar plants. Good luck! :-)
Leslie, Cat sure makes me feel better about asking questions too. Are you planting a bf garden? We can learn together. There are some wonderful people on this forum that graciously shares their knowledge and experience.
Thank you all for the advice about raising Adam. Time to go put the gatorade tissue in his cage.
Deborah
Yeppers...anything and everything we do increases that measley 2% odds.
An excellent butterfly field guide book is the Kaufman Focus Guide: Butterflies of North America. It has all the information needed to identify butterflies no matter where you're at in the the US!!! Everything from great descriptions to enhanced digital images with the best identification markings pointed out, shows both sexes, actual size, distribution, indicates larval host plants and so much more. There are other books on the market geared to specific regions but you really can't beat that Kaufman guide. I highly recommend it.
I have several copies that I keep in the car, in my camera bag, at the ranch and have given several away to relatives so they can identify butterflies before they call me out to drive 20 or so miles because they "found something new" - which really isn't...but to someone not into butterflies...every one they see is something new!!! :o) Okay, sounds like I'm really pushing that book...what can I say, Brock is a frequent visitor to this area and Mexico...as is Jeff Glassberg (author of many, many, many butterfly books) and our local NABA IBP (North American Butterfly Association International Butterfly Park) is Glassberg's baby.
A new updated edition was published in September 2006 but you can get the previous edition for much less. The new edition has additional butterflies specific to the tip of south Texas - where I'm at :o)
Oh, and females have more blue on the topsides...males have that big yellow band.
~ Cat
This message was edited Jul 3, 2007 11:23 PM
I concur with Cat about the Kaufman book, "Field Guide to Butterflies of North America". I recently purchased one from Amazon.com for very reasonable and love it! It's a real asset to IDing butterflies and moths! I wish there was a book that had butterfly AND "caterpillar/chrysalis" IDing in it. But .... I guess that book would be so thick and heavy it wouldn't be practical. :-(
ps...here's a photo of a female BST.
bet now that you've seen a male you can tell the difference :o)
~ Cat
Wonderful news about the Kaufaman Focus Guide! I'll look for it at the bookstore. Again, Cat, many thanks!
Becky,
Ya'll in Florida have Marc Minno's book, Florida Butterfly Caterpillars and Their Host Plants. I have that book...love it!!! We get pretty much of the same butterflies...except for that elusive Atala Hairstreak!!!
I also carry Brock and Glassberg's book, Caterpillars in the Field and Garden everywhere I go :o) as well as David Wagner's Caterpillars of Eastern North America. Yah...I have a big rubber maid tub in the back of my car with gobs of butterfly and moth books :o)
Oh...and another excellent book for beginners is Judy Burris and Wayne Richard's book, The Life Cycles of Butterflies. Has excellent photos of the 23 most common garden butterflies...everything from egg to caterpillar to chrysalis to butterfly to larval host plants and favorite nectar plants.
Judy posts here on occasion and also frequents the advertisement infested GW website.
http://www.butterflynature.com/
~ Cat
This message was edited Jul 3, 2007 10:06 PM
Probably would be too thick. Is there a seperate book published with just caterpillar & chrysalis"?
So it's all in the coloring between the difference between a male & a female BST!
Oh that leads me to another question...Why are there two entirely different colors of female Eastern Tiger Swallowtails? That's what completely through me for a loop when I learned there are two entirely different color variations of female TST. A black one, and a yellow one like the male.
We're cross posting, LOL I'm catching up here, though, taking notes on titles and authors.
Cat - Yes! I have Minno's book, too! That is still my favorite one for IDing purposes here in Florida. But I wanted to see more of the North American butterflies, so bought Kaufman's book as well. I also have David Wagner's, "Caterpillars of Eastern North America". I use them all! LOL! There are so many varieties of butterflies that I could never learn them all. But I am getting very familiar with the Florida butterflies and moths. :-) So much fun!!!
Why are there different colored butterflies of the same species....hmmm...I could go into genetics, biodiversity and polymorphism...but it's easier to say because God was having fun :o)
Okay, well much of it has to do with location (ya know, location, location, location). Then there's genetics, camouflage, other butterflies in the area they have evolved to mimic, brood seasons...guess this might help to think of white ermines in the winter and brown ones in the Spring? Uhm, let me see what else I can confuzzle you with...it's easier to find a mate if the females have different markings - yeah, there have been many stories of male butterflies trying to hit on other males. Ah so many reasons...getting too technical takes the fun out of it...besides I don't know the right answer :o)
~ Cat
Just trying to pick your brain again, Cat. LOL! Throw those big words at me will make me fall out of this chair reaching for the dictionary.
Hey Becky...looks like we can make up some words to impress the newbies and they'll not be the wiser for days to come!!!
Actually...the internet is the best source of information. How did we ever survive without it? :o)
Oh...and speaking of the internet...there are some excellent websites out there on butterflies and moths.
www.butterfliesandmoths.org
www.butterfliesetc.com
www.naba.org
Of course, there's also some for native plants for your region but you'll have to google for them as I'm not familiar with Georgia. Although I did spend a few months in Brunswick/Glencoe years ago. Wish I'd been into butterflies back then...I might not have minded the eight mile runs through the compound. Our PT instructor loved to run...so over creeks and through the woods we went...ugh!!! We all looked like we had chicken pox from all the insect bites!
~ Cat
ps...nobody had the nerve to tell the PT instructor a criminal can't outrun a bullet! ROLF!!!
I've really enjoyed this thread. Congratulations!!
Thank you Crystal. Stay tuned 'cause this saga hasn't ended. There's 4 more crystalids in the cage!
For any interested bf newbies newer than me, here's a link to my first attempts at raising butterflies and making a butterfly cage. Maybe you won't make the same mistakes I did.
Edited : Please use Becky's link to my BST diary page. It seems If at anytime I go to my diary and click on another subject tab, then go back to this thread with this BST link, that link has changed to the last tab I went to in my dairy.
This message was edited Jul 4, 2007 1:01 AM
This message was edited Jul 4, 2007 12:25 PM
Sorry Deborah I just re-read this thread. I am a newbie for sure. I have not even raised any cats yet. I have had them on my dill but never raised them. I ordered one of those Monarch cages someone on this forum mentioned and I am still waiting for it. I would love to go through this process with you. And you are right the people on this forumn are brilliant when it comes to BF's. I am so glad I found this place.
Leslie
I think the link that Deborah was wanting to post is:
http://davesgarden.com/journal/d/t/Cordeledawg/6406/
She is great at documenting her gardens and rearing cats in her DG journal. :-)