The comfrey was finally doing really well, and then this freeze hit. I covered it, but the leaves were dark this morning, with that kind of transluscence you don't like to see. Am I right in thinking it should come back in the spring, or should I toss it into the compost heap and order another come spring?
Will my comfrey recover?
It should come back in spring. I've found that once it gets going it's kind of hard to get rid of.
Good Luck,
Juanita
Thanks, Juanita -- and that's mainly why I keep it in a pot!
We grew comfrey at 6500 feet in the Sierras. It was covered in snow all winter and came back just fine in the spring. Comfrey is great for the garden.
Thanks, g_m -- with those big leaves, it just seems like it would be a lot more tender than it must be. Whatever leaves die, I'll compost, and then wait for the spring. I guess our heat is a lot harder on it than the cold.
The root is the most important part of the comfrey plant. The leaves are seasonal in climates that get frost.
Now that it's completely balmy again (50s at night, 70s during the day, all week at least) the comfrey is looking happier.
I should just relax. Maybe take a little valerian.
Are you growing Valerian too? That is one I want to try and am researching...
I have seeds, and plan to start them in about February. I've never tried them before. You?
I haven't but am intending to try Valerian officinalis this summer. Starting them in Feb is probably a good thought. Southern Herb Growing says it goes dormant in the heat of summer and only sometimes comes back in fall. Generally lasting only one spring. One MSG gal says she grows it in the afternoon shade and if I remember she was in Ms. I'm thinking I will try it in a pot for the first time... and we shall see! : )) pod
I'm thinking some in a pot and some in the ground. I'm PLANNING on having roses surround the herb garden, and that should afford some shade to the herbs. If I tuck it in there just right, it might not broil. Might just plant it in a pot and set the pot in the herb garden so I can move it if I have to.
This sure will be a summer of learning for me -- new place, different soil, all that. I'm looking forward to it.
Great fun, your herb/rose garden plans are lovely and we can't wait to see the outcome. I think the climate isn't too much different from where you moved, is it?
It's a tiny bit different -- like half a zone. Less influence from the Gulf and it gets a little colder here. But every bit as hot, as long, through summer, of course. The soil down there is gumbo, and where I am it's clay.
I did get 20 bags of good soil and 8 bags of manure on Friday, and so the amending is well on its way! Yay! I hope it works!
As everyone says, don't worry about the comfrey it will send up lots of new leaves in spring.
I don't have any trouble growing Valerian here, but it does like moist ground and usually grows wild in ditches, quite wet with some shade. It seeds readily and the original plant has got through three winters now, even with the help of the cats rubbing themselves on it and chewing the tops of the roots. I don't know how it would cope with hot dry summers.
PS...If it doesn't recover, and you'd like more....let me know, you can have all you want of mine. Giving it away (roots or rooted pieces), and drying as many of it's leaves as poss. and cutting finished seedheads is the only way I can keep it from taking over, here....
Cyra
How are you using the dried comfrey?
I cover the leaves with jojoba/grapeseed oil, put lid on the jar, and place it in my kitchen window for approx. a month, strain out the leaves in cheese cloth/colander/funnel set-up, bottle, lable, and refrigerate. Often I reuse the same oil with other herbs, such as St. John's Wort, Chickweed, Calendula, depends on what I'm making an infused oil base for. Later in the year, I make creams, salves, lip balms, etc. using the infused oils as one of my ingredients. Comfrey you don't want to use internally, because it has PA's (harmful alkaloids, please don't make me spell the alkaloid:), and the root has more PA's than the leaves...but the root also has more allantoin (probably mis-spelled, too), which is what you really want to extract from comfrey. Aloe Vera also contains allantoin, and doesn't have the PA's...but my aloes aren't harvestable, yet.
Anyway, you were asking about the Comfrey leaves...that's what I dry them for. Sometimes I give jars of the dried leaves to my friends, who also like to make salves and such, for thier families.
Mine is big now, and in full flower for the second time. The first flowering, I let the bees have it for a while and then cut the flowering stalks off so it wouldn't seed the ground below the pot and force me to fight comfrey all over the place. The bumblebees love it, and the hummingbirds do, too! It's gorgeous, but I suspect the prime is passing. It's now getting really HOT. And I do mean HOT. It's suffering, but I'll do what I can. After a point, you let nature take its course and grow what wants to grow instead of what YOU want to grow. I feel sure the comfrey won't die off entirely, but deep east Texas summer is not its favorite spot. At the least, though, the leaves make fabulous compost.
Yes, I know what you mean, about letting nature take it's course. Unfortunately, I'm selfish, I insist on growing what I like, (and often succeed). I'm glad to hear that you've been successful with pot-culture of comfrey; I was assured by a professional herb vendor that attempting to grow comfrey in pots was the fastest way to kill it, so like an idiot, I planted mine in the ground, and am now having difficulty containing it:) Will do my best to remove it...before it becomes impossible to do so.
From what I've read, it may already be too late! I have mine in a huge (24" diameter) pot, and it's dropping blossoms so I hope it doesn't "take" in the ground. I'm watching it.
Took a picture of it this morning -- it's so big and floppy you can't see that it's in a pot --
I have to put in my two cents on the now generalized belief that comfrey is harmful if taken internally. The problems with most scientific studies on herbs is :
1. They are usually run by drug companies trying to recreate the active ingredient of a herb (cause you cant patent an herb, you have to change the composition or make a unique delivery system). When you isolate the active ingredient you now lose what many herbalist believe is the balance of the other ingredients (that drug companies believe are inactive) which can offset many untoward effects. That's one reason why herbal anti-inflammatories do not cause GI upset or bleeding. All the studies on Comfrey I have seen used allatoin as an isolated ingredient, and I have yet to see a study using the whole herb that had any untoward outcomes.
2. Many studies use unrealistic doses on rats or other test animals. In the one study I read the amount of allatoin given to rats, if duplicated to scale in humans would have equated to more comfrey that a human could or would possibly consume.
Until the US starts testing herbs the way they are consumed (as in the whole herb), be very skeptical on the data. Remember drug companies have no use for the whole herb as they cannot profit from it unless it can be patented. Many of the studies you read about are not the whole herb but isolated components.
Although for legal concerns most herbalist will not recommend Comfrey...mostly out of fear from these misleading studies, I have yet to meet an herbalist who doesnt still use it personally, for close family and friends and would not hesitate to take it internally.
Just IMHO
I eat the younger leaves in salad, stir fry some of them and use both the leaves and root as a medicinal tea when needed. My family has taken comfrey internally for generations. That being said, we don't gorge ourselves on it either. Some folks have the idea that if a little of something is good for you, a lot will be better. Not so!
The Siberian comfrey has more of the controversial alkaloids in it.
Plus... what happens in a rat is not necessarily what happens in a human! But I won't get started on my opinions on animal testing...
The sun is being hard on the comfrey now -- lots of brown leaves for the compost bin being the silver lining on that one. I cut the second flush of blooms off and it's starting on a third! It really does seem very happy. I was out of town for a week so it didn't get watered, but it's doing very well.
pod, if you're there, I did plant that valerian and it's holding up to the heat better than most of the herbs out there. I'll try to remember to get a picture of it. It seems very happy.
I'm here of course... I don't remember if you said, which Valerian did you plant? And from plant or seed?
Hope you had a nice vacation. Will look forward to the photo. pod
Rparrny, while I agree that much FDA herbal data is flawed; still, there are some things I won't take chances with, my liver being one of them:) Besides, I don't need to use comfrey internally, there are less controversial alternatives...
Regards,
cyra
And that is always your option.... If in doubt one should always err on the side of caution...but...like I said no herbalist I know gives it a second thought and I recently attended a conference full of them (including many doctors who practice herbalism) and not one said that they would avoid it for themselves...although most felt that the medical/legal issues involved with that flawed study would keep them from recommending it to patients....and when my 38 pound French Brittany "Vegas" grabbed my brand new jar of comfrey ointment and ate the whole thing...I never even considered going to the vet...I never worried about his liver...and 6 months later he is just fine. If you look at the numbers of deaths with herbs vs. traditional medicines it would blow your mind. In 1998 about 100 Americans died after consuming an herb in some form...and more than 90% of these people were inentionally abusing certain of the more potent members of our herbal pharmacy (possibly Ephedra and Salvia Divinorum although the study didn't site them specifically). In the same time period it appears that no one died injesting an herbal product in a safe recommended dosage. In 1994 between 70 and 130 THOUSAND people died because of the traditional chemical medicines that they took...properly prescribed and taken in the correct dosages. I'll bet the more recent numbers are even more staggering...and yet one idiot dies after trying to speed on massive doses of Ephedra and it's front page news and the herb is banned in that state...but when babies were being born without arms after moms were taking Bendictine for morning sickness...did the government ban it? No, Ralph Nader had to intervene before the government caved under the pressure and finally took it off the market. Make no mistake...the American people are being played by the pharmaceutical companies.
And if your saying to yourself "sure another herbalist bashing the medical community" know this...I have been an herbalist for 20 years and a critical care intensivist for 15...and after 15 years what have I learned? We in the medical community just don't get it....
Okay...I'll get down off my soapbox now...
I agree with you Rparrny - herbs taken IN THE CORRECT DOSAGE are much safer than many of the synthetically produced drugs devised by the pharmaceutical companies.
It amuses me that the pharmaceutical companies rubbish all the remedies that have been used for thousands of years and make out that their products are superior. They have only been analysing and discovering the chemical analysis of things for just over two hundred years and have only relatively recently been able to recreate the isolated active properties. They don't seem to realise that the drug in isolation has far more side effects than the complex mix of ingredients in a herbal extract.
They are the new kids on the block not the herbalists, and the advances in chemical analysis are proving in most cases the properties that the herbal remedies have been used for for centuries are correct. Would people have kept on using them for generations if they didn't work?
Also regarding safety, a small dose can be extremely effective. It does not follow that if something works, taking more will have a greater effect. It is also a good idea not to keep on using the same herb for a long time - have a rest from taking it altogether, or take a different one with similar beneficial properties.
Anyone even pretending to be paying attention is aware of the wide spread corruption within the drug industry. Until recently they weren't threatened by herbalists or whole herbs and were happy to destroy credibility through propaganda. But with the advent of the computer age comes knowledge to all who seek it...and now they ARE threatened. The lastest tactic...if you can't beat em, control em...and now certain whole herbs are being made prescription only in Canada....and guess whos buying up every herb source in site...yup....so now you need a Doc to get it prescribed and a drug company to obtain it. I never said they were stupid...just corrupt...
Lol, rparrny; I've never had my pets go for my ointments, since I use no animal by-products in mine, whose odor might attract them, -but I have to wonder, how did your spaniel manage to unscrew the jar?
Btw, in my case, you might be "preaching to the choir" ; I have no love, or trust, in conventional medicine, what-so-ever. I recognize big-business, when I see it, and I resent it's sales tactics. The women in my family, overseas and state-side, have always preferred and used herbal alternatives, when it came to general family care, with few exceptions, such as broken bones that needed to be set, etc.
I never heard of Bedictine, although I have heard of Bendictines, (a Catholic order) as well as Benedictine, the name of a liquor. I'm guessing you're maybe referring to Thalidomide, which had about 30 - 40 different brand names, when it was marketed, ( http://www.thalidomide.ca/en/information/faces.html ). If so, you're right, it was a terrible, terrible, tragedy.
While I will absolutely admit some of the medical advances that have been made truly are marvelous -- I mean, who's NOT glad we've gotten rid of smallpox? (though I've heard it's not entirely gone) -- whenever ANYTHING becomes an industry like the pharmas have, it's a real shame. They're in it for the money. Well, who isn't? I wouldn't go to my job if I didn't make money at it!! But the true cost of what they're doing, both medically and socially, is so enormous I can't even comprehend it.
But you can't pass a law that makes people or industries or corporations have a social conscience. I wonder how these people sleep at night. And if they're going to raid my garden and put me in jail for growing comfrey, or goldenseal, or st. john's wort.
I haven't been to a doctor in a LONG time, and won't unless I need to. If I break a leg, I'll want a doctor to set it. Otherwise...
Cyra,
Vegas is smart as a whip and I also use no animal products in my salves, but he loves olive oil and coconut oil...I found the lid intact and the plastic jar somewhat bent. My guess is the pressure of biting the jar popped the lid off. If he sees me put any ointment on...he tries to lick it off...lol.
Brigidily,
See...now ya got me started...let me tell you about the small pox vaccine...by the time the WHO launched thier initiative for global vaccination in 1967 the disease had pretty much been eradicated in 8 out of 10 countries. They have been vaccinating since the 1800's and if you look at the numbers it shows the the vaccine caused more cases of smallpox than the disease itself. The disease was more likely eradicated as a result of better more consistant sanititation in highly populated areas. Interestingly enough, the most severe epidemic occurred following mandatory shots. In England from 1870-1872 after more than 15 years of forced immunizations and a 98 percent vaccination rate, the largest epidemic of smallpox ever recorded maimed and killed thousands of people. Most of the population had been vaccinated and revaccinated. A quote from the Statistics of the Registar-General in London..."Smallpox attained its maximum mortaility AFTER vaccination was introduced".
I could go on and on about most vaccinations...the plague is gone too and we never had a vaccination for it either. Most of the diseases that we got vaccinated for were on the decline as per nature. And if you look at the numbers... once a vaccine was introduced, the numbers jumped UP. So what did the drug companies do? They got the disease redefined so that it looks like the numbers are going down...and all this stuff is public record...ya can't make this stuff up. The worst part is that the vaccine changed the population that would get affected. Before the vaccine, measles affected young children 5-9 years old and had only rare instances of serious affects, after the vaccine it went to those age groups more likely to suffer serious complications, infants, teens and adults. When I was in school and doing my pediatric rotation we were told...vaccinations NEVER EVER cause a reaction and you will NEVER tell a parent that it did. Yet the numbers show that most cases of SIDS occur at 2 and 4 months at the time of DPT shots. In Japan, they raised the age of pertussis shots to 2 years and the numbers of SIDS deaths and other adverse reactions plummeted...funny how that stuff never makes the news.
The more I discovered about the cover ups going on with vaccines the scarier it got. Make no mistake, we are being played by pharmacuetical companies. One of the most responsible books on the subject is: Vaccines are they really safe and effective? by Neil Miller. He gives you the reference for every study and fact he lists so that you can look it up yourself. It was the first book I found that got a couple of docs to endorse publicly...a rare feat. Be warned, you'll probably never want a vaccine again after reading it....
I still think there is a place for vaccines, in high risk populations...I have my elderly mother take a flu shot every year, only because I work in a hospital and tend to bring a lot home...I however do not take the vaccine, my unit is a surgical intensive care and infectious illnesses are not all that common although they do happen. Interestingly enough I was one of three people who did not get the vaccine last year and most who did were out sick with SOMETHING...although they denied it was the flu. The three of us who didn't....nada, zip, nothing...
Interesting, to say the least. I did not know those statistics on vaccines, but (unfortunately) they don't surprise me.
So what does a person do, when you can't put your kids into school unless they've had the shots? THAT's the really scary part. I'd say more, but I suspect we're bordering on taboo politics.
Sickness is a part of life and it may seem heartless to say it but it DOES cull out the population. We're the only species who takes more care of our weak than our strong (and I wouldn't have it any other way) and possibly the biggest problem we face is overpopulation. Food for thought.
And there is a hospital in Louisiana that takes care of plague victims, from what I've heard. It's still around.
Bubonic/pneumonic plague is endemic in most of the western US. It usually just affects the wild rodent population, although there was a human death from it in South Lake Tahoe about 20 years or so ago. The woman supposedly caught it from her cat sneezing on her. The cat supposedly got it from the local squirrels. The incidence of spread to humans is so rare that no one thought to test her for plaque and treated her for flu instead. Still, this is very rare.
I know Lousiana had a hospital specializing in leprosy treatment, but that was closed in the 1990's.
http://www.cnn.com/US/9804/24/last.lepers/
As far as I know, from my personal research on vaccines, the only one that has really been proven to work is one that you take AFTER you have been exposed to the disease - that's the rabies vaccine that folks received after being bitten by a rabid animal. Improvements in sanitation and nutrition have done more to keep people healthy. When a person is worn out from war and/or poverty, they have little resistance to disease.
The vaccination requirement of public schools is one of the reasons many parents choose to home school.
Rparrny ~ Odd, the vax thing was the topic of discussion at work today.
A friend is an ICU nurse normally working in a large metro area. He is now working in ICU in a small hospital here to be near his elderly, ill DM. He is committed to working a few days monthly at the large hospital to keep his hand in it. He just got back in town and was telling there is a study released in the medical community that the 'shaken' children syndrome may very well be connected to specific vaccinations. The vaccinations cause unaccounted for bruising and when they question the childs' parent/guardian, they are now to also inquire about recent vaccinations... apparently thinning the childs blood causing the least bump to bruise? The percentage 'shaken' and vaccination connections are unbelieveably high. I don't remember the exact figure. He said the unknown quantity is those who never bring the child to a health care facility out of fear, so perhaps even higher.
Yes, I agree we are overpopulated and most definitely on the home schooling issue!
Sorry about the delay in response, my sick computer is in the shop for the next two weeks and I'm responding from work.
Brig,
What's a person to do? When my daughter finally gets off her butt and gives me a grandchild I will advise her to stay away from the pediatricians office. Studies show that well child visits are a waste of time, the 5 minutes spent on the exam statisically doesn't pick up most problems...just exposes your well kid to sick kids. The growth charts are based on formula fed babies and make a breast fed baby look underweight. Since breast fed babies get all of Mom's immunities (and now there are some who believe that the placental immunities last much longer after birth than anyone realised) there's no rush to vaccinate. Talking to one of the nurses here tonight, her pediatrician doesn't give the first vaccine until 6 months, than a year, than 18 months...quite a change from the norm and much safer in my opinion. I would put off vaccines as long as possible if my child was not in day care...and then would only give those that were required by law.
I think the pediatricians are finally realizing that they are being lied to as well...seems they are getting much more vocal...
And Texas wanting to make the HPV vaccine mandatory for 11 year olds...absolute nonsense. Not sure about Texas but I don't know all that many 11 year olds that are sexually active...and HPV is a disease of sexually active females. I'm all for protecting the public, but it seems that the public in most cases is not in need of protection. It unfortunately all seems to be linked to the almighty buck...
Protecting us from ourselves... Not!
I agree on the absolute nonsense.
Amen! It astounds me how the governor just seemed to believe no one would notice! Very interesting about the link between vaccines and the shaken baby syndrome. I wonder how many convictions there have been based on mistake on that score. Makes you shudder to think someone may actually be in prison because They insist on your vaccinating your child, probably needlessly, and you just obeyed the law. And someone else is making an absolute fortune off the whole thing.
Do I hear a tiny little farm away from civilization calling my name...?
lol ~ if you find the "tiny little farm away from civilization" PLMK! Everywhere is getting way tooo developed for me!
Oh, yeah! I'll tell you, then you'll tell garden_mermaid, then she'll tell cyra...
(Then we could get together and afford it!)