Need any thoughts on my mud filled pond

This is a picture of my pond this morning. Yesterday it was EMPTY. We had monsoon type rain last night. I thought I had solved this problem with the medium size rocks I placed around the back and to the right side to stop the flow of water. I don't know if the water came through that area last night (it was too dark to tell). We emptyied it a few weeks ago and pulled the plants and fish out to clean it because previously muddy water had overflowed it. When I drained it there was mud all over. I had to spray the mud down to wash it out and pump the muddy water out. That was a real chore.

I really don't want to put everything back in it until I have this problem solved and I'm afraid that my fish won't be able to survive in the 29 gal aquarium for a long extended period if it gets too cold.

I am grasping at the possibility that maybe someone around me might be able to come and look at it first-hand and give me suggestions.

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated. ~~~ Carol

Carol

Your pond is lovely. I don't understand where the mud came from. I'm gonna give you a link to my pond diary. I am still working on it but the pictures should give you an idea.

http://davesgarden.com/journal/d/m/jeri11/

I've had my pond for 10 years and never had your problem. Just about everything else has happened, but not that. I have an overflow at the back of the pond that drains into a main drain. I overflow it on purpose about once a month for 30 min. and it pulls all the leaves and stuff out of my pond. I'm lazy and this is easier than scimming it for leaves and trash.

Thanks, I will read over it. Quick overview of pictures show a nice place.

caganimalover,

Some questions first:
Is the pond lined? It looks like the waterfall could receive flow from the areas on the other side of the wall, then go into the pond. Can water go over the retaining wall (or through it for that manner if it's dry stacked)? Is there any type of berm around the beginning of the waterfall? Have you been able to go outside during the rain and see where it is flowing from? Sorry for all the questions!

1) Yes it has a large thick liner.
2) You mean under the waterfall liner? The other day I forgot about the soaker hose had left it on for a really long time and there was a little water that went down into the pond. If it is going under the liner, got any ideas on how to fix that problem?
3) The wall is solid. A very few holes were left for drainage, but I don't know if they actually do drain. Water unfortunately does go over the wall. I am working on coming up with a solid plan on how to fix that problem without putting in another wall up above the current wall.
4) The top of the Waterfall has a HUGE rock (put there because it was the only location we could get it in due to the weight). The actual container where the water comes out is infront of the rock and sets approximately 4" above the bottom of the rock.
5) Yep, not a pretty picture. We thought (until this morning) that ALL the muddy water problems were coming over the right corner where the big rock in front and the wall meet. We didn't suspect the water draining from other areas causing a direct problem with filling up the pond since we had seen the water POURING over that corner. I was real dissapointed this morning when I got up and saw the pond full. I had placed 3 rock barriers on the right side of the waterfall to stop the flow that came over that corner. Couldn't see last night it was too dark, but I am suspecting that my barriers worked for that corner problem spot and that there is even more water causing problems from another portion of the wall or coming around the curb from the driveway. We didn't think the water from other locations was going INTO the pond because the edging around the pond sits a tad bit higher than the patio and angles slightly upward (what we thought would keep water from going in). ~~~ Carol

I had somebody come out to give me suggestions on how to keep from having "water run off" and he was no help at all. The only suggestion he had was to fill in with grass. Wow, what a great idea. Idiot. We already did that and it and most of it died because whatever the underlying reason is (that stuff doesn't want to grow and rain washes the ground away), wasn't addressed. We had put grass in front of the house from one side to the other.
Now, I have no grass again and water coming down everywhere.


This message was edited Nov 6, 2006 9:47 PM

Well, your flagstones are clean all around the pond so that should narrow it down for you.

Carol

I'm confused. I do not see where the mud is coming from. The surrounding appears to be clean. Is it coming over the back where the rocks are? That doesn't look possible.

Jeri

There is a little area with some dirt residue on the flagstone (to the right in the photo) but NOTHING compared to what is in the pond. It's really confusing. That's why I don't know which way to go to DO anything to fix the problem. I WISHED it had done the monsoon act during the light of day so I could narrow it down further.

At one time we watched it pour from the side (there where I put the 3 lines of rocks) then out the corner where the large rock, at the bottom, meets the wall on the right.

Suppose it is coming in under the waterfall liner at the top; Any ideas on how to verify that and if verified, what to do to fix it?
(The liner was laid on the ground and the rocks placed on top.)

This is a picture of the first time (March 2006) it rained hard (similar to a mini monsoon, like last night) and the water was hitting the flowerbed wall and sending the muddy water onto the porch and patio. Then the water was definitely muddy and mud was everywhere unlike this time when there is not all the tons of mud all over the patio. After that we created barriers with rocks and dirt to try and alter the direction of the water run-off. ~~~ Carol

Carol

I showed your pictures to my husband and he said it's seeping in at the waterfall. He said if the water gets 6" to build the retaining wall 8" high to stop it.

I hope this helps.

Jeri

Thanks for checking with your husband. (and I'm sure he offered to drive few hours to Texas to help me fix it? LOL Silly question) He thinks I should build mini-wall around the waterfall?
Oooo, what about putting in an underground flexible drains?

Here is a picture behind and around the waterfall top and how water flows around it. A little goes in, but there may have been so much rain that a little was a lot. I just found out that the town closest to us gauged 5 inches of rain the other night (all within a few hours)!

My husband said to dig the drain down 4-5" and build a retaining wall up 6."

Here is a picture of my retaining wall(the framed up section in the back) This is the ledge that the rocks sat on. It is 2' high X 2' thick.

Where does your name come from? Are you from Louisiana?

Jeri

You mean caganimalover? cag (my initials) + animal + lover = I am an animal lover
Never lived in Louisiana. Born, and lived in Fort Worth my whole life til 23yrs. The past 20yrs have been in this same location in Joshua.

This message was edited Nov 7, 2006 7:12 PM

Caganimalover,

I think I've got a solution. I'm assuming that you're patio doesn't drain toward the pond, and that the flow is just coming from the land above the pond and wall. Please see my attached sketch. The berm should be well packed, but can have looser soil on top to form a planting bed. This should limit the flow to just the area between the berm and the pond. You can extend the berm/rasied bed to be raised from behind the waterfall (at least 2' behind the big rock) to the retaining wall.

And your other question....I have flow from rain storms under my pond liner due to movement of water through the soil. If you have no leaks in your liner and the flow from your waterfall is entering the pond only and not under the liner the water should flow away on it's own after a few days. The weight of the water in your pond should discourage the "floating liner" effect if the adjacent soil is not saturated. If you still have problems you can install a tile drain under the pond which will encourage water in the soil to leave the area more quickly.

Great drawing. Thanks so much. So just make a raised area around the entire section? Any suggestions on how to keep the dirt from washing off the berm?

I think I would put in the underground flex hose covered in river rock several place around your drive and the patio. If the water is going between the rock and liner you might could seal it with Great Stuff. It wouks well on waterfalls for its sealant ability. I know your going crazy over the muddy water. I hope you find a reasonable solution.

Tami

I think the flex drain hose couldn't hurt. I've been thinking about that too.
Great Stuff, hadn't heard of that. Will have to look into it. Thanks ~~~ Carol

Carol,
Great stuff is insulation in a can. They sell it at Home Depot. I have heard from pond builders that it works great on water falls and we used it on our sons waterfall. It won't harm the fish after it drys.
I built raised flower beds along our fence for my Plumerias. I used the scalloped border rocks for the edging. When it rained I realized I had forgot about the water being trapped. I had to put in underground drain pipes from the yard and into the ditch. I have to keep them clean but they work great.

Tami

The stuff I found at HD is "Beckett" Waterfall Foam Sealant. Cost $13 a can! What area/department is the Great Stuff located? Maybe it runs a tad lower in cost(?).

Carol,
It is cheeper. Look in building supplys. Ask for it if you don't find it. Seems like its around $5 a can. You don't have to have the beckett stuff.

Tami

Wow, that is a huge savings. Thanks for the information. ~~~ Carol