After much research and a meeting with my County Ag Agent, I have made the decision to burn Brugs tomorrow.
I'm starting with the ones most infested, then all those grown from seeds which have mites regardless of the degree, then I'm whacking off limbs of the others if I can see mites with a magnifying lens. I'm stripping off lower big leaves on all the brugs and my DH is going to spray all of them for the 4th time.
The County Ag Agent came out after I called him yesterday. He took several samples for testing, including a 6 inch limb high up on my CG that just went limp. No other part of this very large plant was wilted or limp. I had the same thing with a Frosty a couple of weeks ago, but I cut it off and threw it away. It has been miserably hot here with very little rain and those are the conditions that mites love.
The Ag Agent and I decided on the slash and burn treatment, then 4 more sprayings with Talstar One, 5 days apart. The Talstar One solution will include Ivory Dishwashing Liquid as a surfactant, meaning it will cause the pesticide to adhere to the leaves longer.
We are using this pesticide because we have additional pests to kill, one of which is Broad Mites. Avid also requires additional spraying to kill this mite. The following added 8/27: Floramite I checked the label, it will not kill broad mites
If you are growing brugs, then you know how hard this is for me to do.
Judy
The following is a write-up I prepared for myself and added additional notes for the Brug Newbies so they would not find themselves in my position.
This message was edited Aug 27, 2006 11:39 AM
Brugmansia Slash & Burn
The two-spotted spider mite is the most common 'warm season' mite. The females over-winter in the soil or on the plants, either in the yard, garden or in potted plants stored for the winter and become active early Spring.
Perfect Spider Mite Weather
Dry conditions greatly favor spider mites, plus plants stressed by drought can produce changes in their chemistry that make them more nutritious to spider mites. Therefore they can develop rapidly during this time, in as little as a week after hatching the females produces a dozen eggs daily for a couple of weeks. The fast development rate and high egg production can lead to rapid increases in mite populations
Early Detection
Early detection of spider mites, before damage is noticed, is important. The tiny spider mites can be detected by holding either a piece of white paper or cardboard under a leaf, then thump the front side of the leaf. If mites are present, they will be dislodged and can be seen walking slowly on the paper.
Quarantine and Inspection.
Mites as well as other insects, virus and fungus are often introduced into your environment on infested plants or their soil. Carefully inspect, preferably with a magnifying lens, any plant or cutting being introduced into your environment. Do the above white paper test for mites and inspect the total plant for other insects and problems. If mites or insects are detected and the plant was purchased it should be immediately returned to the vendor.
If you are bringing in plants without soil or cuttings, swishing it a 10% Clorox solution to which Ivory dish washing liquid has been added will be of benefit as would a dip in a medicide or insecticide solution with good miticide activity such as (Talstar). However if upon inspection mites, are detected on plants you can’t take back, consider toss them before you get attached. If you won’t toss a full mite treatment should be given. Be sure to quarantine all new plants for a minimum of 4 weeks, to insure they are clean.
Spider Mite Treatment
To eliminate Spider Mites, trim, bag and removed heavily infested leaves, clean up all plant debris … discard severely infested plants. Choose one of the following pesticides/miticides and follow the instructions. Be sure to continue your spraying program until all eggs are hatched and the resulting mites are killed. Some of the miticides listed kill both adults and eggs but are very expensive and may not be available to non-professionals.
NOTE: Spider Mites hatch in 3-20 days after they are laid, depending upon the weather. The hotter and dryer it is the faster they hatch. I believe mites have continued to give me a problem because I didn’t spray long enough to kill the last hatching eggs. Also washing them off with the water hose caused them to drop into the soil in and around the pot, so they missed the pesticide.
The following information on pesticides is from http://www.ext.colostate.edu/PUBS/INSECT/05507.html
The list was last reviewed Jan 2004, therefore Forbid and more recent products are not included
Table 1: Pesticides useful to control spider mites in yards and gardens. (Not to be used inside the house.)
Active Ingredient Trade Name(s)
Comments second line
Acephate, Orthene & certain Isotox formulations
Insecticide with some effectiveness against spider mites. Systemic.
Personal experience - JudyCooksey: damages the leaves of some Brugs & tender plants.
Abamectin, Avid (Recommended by Monika)
For commercial use only on ornamental plants. Primarily effective against two-spotted spider mite; less effective against mites on conifers. Limited systemic movement.
Bifenthrin, Talstar & others
Insecticide with good miticide activity.
Dimethoate, Cygon
Insecticide with fair miticidal activity. Few food crop registrations. Systemic.
Dicofol, Kelthane
Selective miticide labeled for some food crops in addition to ornamental plants. Some reduced activity at higher temperatures.
Hexythiazox, Hexygon
For commercial use only on ornamental plants. Selective miticide that affects developing stages and eggs only. One application per season label restriction.
Horticultural oils, Sunspray & others
Used at the "summer oil" rate (2 percent), oils are perhaps the most effective miticide available for home use.
Insecticidal soap, several
Marginally effective against two-spotted spider mite and where webbing prevents penetration. Broadly labeled.
Sulfur, various
Generally sold in dust formulation for control of various fungal diseases and some mites on some ornamental and vegetable crops.
(1W.S. Cranshaw, Colorado State University Cooperative Extension entomologist and professor, and D.C. Sclar, research assistant; bioagricultural sciences and pest management. Reviewed 1/04.)
Wintering-Over Brugmansias
Spider Mites in the house can be particularly frustrating because the only safe chemical controls are soaps and horticultural oils, pesticide treatments should be done outside not in the house.
In the home environment spider mites can stay active all winter since the warm season continues. Those stored for the winter where temperatures are cooler, but above freezing should not reach damaging populations.
If spider mites are identified, it is recommended that all susceptible plants, not just your brugmansia be treated at the same time. Trim, bag and remove heavily infested leaves and discard severely infested plants, hose small plants in the sink or shower. Wipe leaves of larger plants with a soft, damp cloth. When the plants are dry use soaps, horticultural oils not necessary to take them outside but if you opt for pesticide do this outside only. Reapply these treatments every 5 days as long as populations persist.
Doing it the organic way…. http://www.ghorganics.com/page9.html#Mites
Additional Reading
http://www.mobot.org/gardeninghelp/plantfinder/IPM.asp?code=115&group=48&level=s
http://www.negreenhouseupdate.info/greenhouse_update/?p=2453
This is a write up I prepared for myself and thought I would share it in hopes that it would give a jumpstart to the “newbies”.
I encourage all experienced brug growers to post comments, tell me immediately if I’ve made an error or provide us with personal experience with a specific pesticide.
I compiled this information from several sources: Brugmansia Forum threads, my online research and conversations with my County Ag Agent. I have included the information on pesticides and miticides because so many questions have been asked about them.
Judy...very well written and explained..great job..now kill them little buggers..
Judy, good job. I just have one question: What about systemics? Did your Ag agent say anything about Hi-yield Di-Syston? Also, I didn't see anything about Floramite?
Are you truly going to burn your brugs Judy? I surely can see the frustration with them. And I am in a short season climate. I can imagine the longer and hotter climes are a lot worse.
If you do get rid of your brugs, do you think you will ever try again? If so, you need to buy only from vendors you truly know have good plants and then do the dip. Did he say anything about soil drenches to overwinter?
Take care and keep us posted. Jeanette
Wow! That's extreme... I'm sorry your dealing with such trouble. Thank you for posting the info!! Big Help.
Thank you , I copied and pasted everything you wrote .
Eclipse & GardenGuyKin - Thanks for the support
Jnette - I didn't consider Floramite at first but after having read the posting on the other thread, I checked the label, will not kill broad mites.
I'm not burning out of frustration, it is to prevent further infestation. Slashing off limbs to burn or burning whole highly infested brugs, those that are spider magnets, will resolve some of the problem before they can move to the clean brugs many of which are doubles (even a couple of double pinks) Hibiscus & Roses. Think of it as throwing out a bad apple before it ruins the barrel of apples.
ZZsBabiez - thanks for the words of sympathy, it's hard but necessary
Judy
Out of the first 15 small pots of brugs:
(Remember they have been sprayed 4 times)
4 - totally clean
2 - went into the burn pile
1 - a virus I believe, so I'm going to call the Ag Agent & ask him to visit
1 - between two branches, I could see a small web with 3 live mites moving around inside it but thumping of the leaves did not produce live mites on the white cardboard.
7 - I really had to look hard and do a lot of thumping of leaves but eventually a live mite or two fell on the cardboard.
I originally planned to burn the last 8 brugs on the list, but since they had so few mites, I treated them with a double blast, 1) kill live mites and their eggs, 2) a systemic as a preventive.
1) Schultz Fruit & Vegetable Insect Spray, because the plants were small and there was minimum danger in using the product plus it is both a miticide and ovicide. http://www.schultz.com/ProductCategories/IndoorInsecticides/FruitsVegetablesInsectSpray/
Update *******
Crispy Fried Brug Leaves !!!!!
The Schultz "Garden Safe Brand" Fruit & Vegetable Insect Spray fried the leaves. I tried it on the tomato plants first and it didn't fry them, but it sure fried the brugs. Oh well either they will put back out or they'll go in the burn pile, as I first intended. I will post an update later.
2) Bayer Advanced™ 2-in-1 Systemic Rose and Flower Care Ready-To-Use Granules http://www.bayeradvanced.com/garden/products/details.cfm?id=3 with kills spider mites.
These brugs were across the yard from the brugs identified with broad mites, therefore I'm hopeful they do not have them. I isolated these brugs from all others after the above treatment and marked them with "BS" meaning Bayer/Scultz treatment.
4 clean brugs got Bayer Advanced 2-in1 They are isolated from all others
I will provide updates on how this experiment worked. I feel good about the results thus far.
--------------
Lunch is over so now it's back outside to continue working on the brugs.
Judy
This message was edited Aug 27, 2006 2:39 PM
This message was edited Aug 27, 2006 4:25 PM
Judy....
What a great source of info.
Even tho I have thrown in the towel on brugs, there are still a lot of other plants that are fighting the dreaded mites... thanks for doing so much legwork for the rest of us.
This is something that will be going on MY fridge door....
Kris
Kris,
How kind of you to post.
Judy
Judy - I am sick for you! I still have not had one blossom, so the I'd probably just burn the masses if it was me. But you - Lordy, my friend! You have such beauties and have worked so hard! Dang!
Sequee,
Circumstances were such that I didn't get on the problem quick enough, so it was my fault.
1) Feb - friend died
2) Mar - beloved pet died taking part of my heart
3) April - suddenly our house in Memphis sold so we had to quickly move everything up here to the farm the end of April
4) In the middle of the move my father had a stroke and died a few days later ... I still haven't unpacked everything
5) We had 2 litters of puppies and you know how I am about my "babies".
Once we got through all this, Bob and I were just exhausted and when you're in that shape you just don't see everything you should.
The good news we got through it all and are bouncing back. It is so kind of you to care.
Judy
Oh, dear! Not the loss of one of the Kids AND your Dad! You are one strong lady - I'b be mush in a basket!!!
Hugs to you and Bob. Was it one of the Babies I know???
PekeBoo's had a rough year. Lots of allergies are getting him down. We've tried everything and he's doing pretty well. He's the same lovable ball of fire at times, and sleeps alot the rest of the time. He even gave up his space in bed (gasp!), preferring to curl up in his own space nearby. Hannibal is delighted to have the "Top Dog" space, and always defers to his brother before before settling it. Such good boys.
2 new litters? How DO you do it???
I feel for you Judy, I have 2 brugs so far that is really doing good, but all the rest really look bad.
Then I have about 6 of my Hibiscus that I am not sure if they are going to make it to fall. I plan on cutting them back and removing all leaves and using neem before they ever go into the GH.
This has been a very bad summer for the brugs and hibiscus. But the bugs have liked it. They are really terrible.
Good Luck Judy
Linda
Sequee, it was my hard-headed, 11 year old Sassy T, who would look at me as if to say "humans are so hard to train". The average life span for a Bully is 9 years so we were thankful she lived as long as she did, but weren't expecting her "to go" because her mother loved to be 13.
Linda, I use the Bayer Advanced 2-in1 Rose as a preventive on my hibiscus and they have been insect FREE!! The rose of sharons however have had some aphids, but cleared up after being sprayed once with the Talstar.
********
Crispy Fried Brug Leaves !!!!!
The Schultz "Garden Safe Brand" Fruit & Vegetable Insect Spray fried the leaves. I tried it on the tomato plants first and it didn't fry them, but it sure fried the brugs. Oh well either they will put back out or they'll go in the burn pile, as I first intended.
Judy
This message was edited Aug 27, 2006 6:15 PM
Judy,
You've got mail
Bless your spirit, my firend! Life has not always been kind to you, but did you get Big Dayy, so I'm not gonna feel too bad for you!!!
Judy I know how much you hated doing this but we do what we have to sometimes like it or not. LMK what you had to burn and if I have them will give you cuttings.
Ruth
Ruth,
Thank you. How nice of you to offer!!
Judy
Judy what a year you've had. Most folks would crumble with only one of those terrible times. it's good to see that you are on the road back to some what normalcy.
I feel for you doing the 'slash & burn'. I'm almost at that point where a few of my brugs are so badly infested that they've been sprayed it seems like forever and yet the mites keep coming! They are not the most impressive brugs anyway, so I think they are on their way out to the municiple garden waste bins.
Linda
Hugs Judy ! Same here...my year with Brugs was not good either but mostly my fault for not feeling well enough to do what needed to be done. They are growing and I do have semi hard wood on most of mine, like Day Dreams, Pink Velvet, Pink Petticoats, Charles Grimaldi, Isabella, Dr Seuss and a few others. DD is very small but has 3 Y's, so I am very encouraged that I will see blooms soon.
Let me know what you lost and if I have it, I'll try my darndest to get you a rooted cutting or a piece to root. I have them in pots, planted in the ground and everywhere else...very different from last year. Last year I knew where every one of them were and what their names were and everything else. This year my heart has just not been into gardening, especially since mid April. I am just beginning to work with some seeds that some dear Dave's friends gave me. I am hoping to have a better Fall than I did Spring. My very special Morning Glory seeds are just about to bloom and I am ecstatic. Next comes tomatoes...and Brugs !!!
Fortunately, my health will soon be doing better (compression fractures in disks in my Lumbar area) but it will be months of injections before I will be back to normal. I thought my gastric bypass weight loss (136 lbs) would take care of it but it actually just made me more aware there was a real problem which caused me to get an MRI....ughhhh.....those spinal injections are not, NOT, not fun, but my Doctor says by 3rd round I ought to be significantly better. Had first round this past Monday (8-21) 2nd is on 9-11-06....then we go on a 9 day cruise and when I return I get 3rd treatment. I can have up to 4 treatments...then if they don't help, we move to a different treatment. I don't know what that will be.They was mention of total nerve block...but I'm not going there, yet :))
God bless you all...and just in case I haven't told ya'll lately...I love and miss you all bunches and you're always in my thoughts and prayers even when I am not here with you. God bless and keep you all safe, Margo
MG99 - Thank you so much for your kind words!!
jlmmkm - 136 lbs, how wonderful!!! I know you are proud of the weight loss and am hopeful that your treatments will help your back pain. Have enough fun on your cruise for the rest of us!!! Thanks ever so much for the offer of replacement brugs. Your kindness means a lot to me.
Judy
Margo,
There you are!! I was wondering why we haven't seen you. I'm sorry you've had such a cummy year, but I'm tickled for you with the bypass surgery. I bet you look fantastic!
I have a friend who just completed 3 rounds of spinal injections and she has done wonderfully. Says it's the most pain free she's felt in years! So I'm hoping it works as well for you.
I forget which cuttings you sent to me, but the unknown white that is so fragrant (as you marked) is doing great. It's suffered a little from this heat and humidity and drought here, but she's hung in there and starting to flush better. She even got smacked by one of our storms and I lost a couple of limbs, but she's doing well. I had intended to mark all the cuttings you sent with your name and the brug's name, but, you know, you always think you'll remember then you don't! Especially at this age. That's the biggest thing I learned this summer -- write it all down!! LOL.
I miss "home" so much. The market here has tanked and prices are declining. I've gone a property on the market that's already priced $100,000 less than I paid for it! That was my retirement so it's a downer. It makes me think about coming home.
Hope you and Jim have a great time on your cruise and please check back in the garden to let us all know how you're doing.
Blessings,
Barbara
The Award For Excellence - Goes To SherryLike
See her 8/28 posting on this thread after you read the below information
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/640788/
HI-YIELD DI-SYSTON SYSTEMIC INSECTICIDE GRANULES
This product can be used on houseplants even!!!! See the below and verify it yourself via the link below!
Ornamental Plants (soil Treatment)
Aphids
Lace Bugs
Leafhoppers
Spider Mites
Thrips
Whiteflies
Ornamental Plants (containerized)
Aphids
Lace Bugs
Leafhoppers
Spider Mites
Thrips
Whiteflies
Ornamental Plants (houseplants)
Aphids
Lace Bugs
Leafhoppers
Spider Mites
Thrips
Whiteflies
Ornamental Plants (interior Plantscapes)
Aphids
Lace Bugs
Leafhoppers
Spider Mites
Thrips
Whiteflies
http://www.kellysolutions.com/ma/showpestsitecombo.asp?EPAID=7401%2D323&ProductName=HI%2DYIELD+DI%2DSYSTON+SYSTEMIC+INSECTICIDE+GRANULES
Thanks a bunch SherryLike and Judy
Miss Skinny Minnie!!! I have already told you that you can't be a teenager again!!! LOL!! Love to Jack and Mom.
And, fighting off Mites again...I learned that being around a bush WITH mites lets you carry some back to a clean one...or other plants....and....
YYUUCCKK
I'm going to use the Hi-Yield Di-Syston to clean up these spider mites, then I have to figure out how to return to a well balanced natural environment.
I think we first became unbalanced (lol lol) when the rat snakes eat too many of the tree frogs. Mama rat snake had a big birthing event two years ago. Last year we noticed the lower than normal number of tree frogs, etc. Then this long dry spell and extreme heat caused the natural enemies of the spider mite to die and the spider mites to flourish. Now I'm killing off all the beneficial insects with the poisons we've been spraying. Whew!!!
AlohaHoya - Thanks for the tip about transfering the mites via hands and clothes to clean plants.
I didn't realize they are also transferred by portions of their web acting like a balloon in the wind.
Judy
Oops....called the Farmers Co-Op and was told in the state of TN, Hi-Yield Di-Syston is a restricted chemical and you must show restricted chemical use card. I was told you get card/permit through the Cnty Ag Agent and they thought the only requirement was watching a 4 hr video.
Judy
This message was edited Aug 29, 2006 6:23 PM
So, Judy, when do you get to watch the video? The Di-Syston sounds like great stuff -- worth watching a 4 hour video.
I've been lurking.....Judy, I'm sorry about your brugs! Hope next year is better with fewer bugs.
Di Syston is toxic to birds, even a small amount can be fatal to a little bird, be sure and fully incorporate the granules into the soil, so critters don't eat them.
fly_girl
Thanks for posting on this thread... that is just the type of info we need so it will be here as a warning to do it right!!
Judy
