Hoya Names & Clone Numbers Compilation

I was thinking maybe we could each list the hoya's that we have with their names and clone numbers - I think it would be useful.

Here are the clone numbers I have so far. I'm going to check with Liddle's catalogue and see if I can get some more.

aff. Anulata IML 1120
archboldiana YM Excellent IML 560
camphorifolia IML 0418
lamingtonii IML 70 (aka sp. PNG-1 and sp. PNG-4)
lobbii IML 1161
macgillivrayi IML 16
memoria IML 107
verticillata IML 146
sp. Nong Nooch IML 1541
sp. Philippines IML 831
tjadasmalanqensis IML 1181

latifolia IML88
australis ssp. australis 'Brookfield' IML256
patella (pink) IML1096
pottsii from Mcllwaith Ra.Q ld IML22

Those are the only ones I'm certain of. And you're right, it's allready proving useful. I didn't know that DL's red archboldiana in his catalog was the same as Ted Green's YM Excellent.

Mark, that archboldiana YM Excellent IML number may be incorrect. The dealer I purchased it from is not reliable. Take that clone number with a grain of salt.

Ann, did you get your archie from Smoley's?

No, from a lady in Eugene, OR

benguetensis IML 0772
calycina IML 0201
chlorantha IML 1352
coriacea IML 716
cummingiana IML 0168
cv. Iris Marie IML 0000
davidcummingii IML 0892
diversifolia IML 0083
erythrina IML 0415
sp. HSI-037 IML 461
heuschkeliana Pink IML 832
heuschkeliana Yellow IML 904
imperialis ssp. Rauchii IML 0245
lacunosa ssp. Pallidaflora IML 0045
limoniaca IML 0092
melifula ssp. Fraterna IML 0I24
naumanii IML 0198

more to come later

I have a question....posting it on a new thread with a photo so I don't mess up your thread.....H. sp. 1198?

Suz...it is an unidentified species hoya collected by DL IML 1198.

I have a complete hoya list on my website. I need to update it...it is, I hope, going to have all of the IML numbers...and/or where I acquired it. This, I think is important to record. Now...it is really for my records.....but I feel it should be shared...as all lists should.

me..

tsangii/DS-70 IML 0062
vitellina IML 0452
walliniana IML 0232

That is it for the plants that I am sure of their numbers (except for the archie listed above). I hope others will add to this since I believe this will be useful given all the name changes and whatnot that happen - as long as we have clone numbers we know what we have. Carol's list is really a treasure to access - it has lots of the plants with their clone numbers listed http://www.bigislandgrowers.com/ghp/AHlist.php

Now I have some questions:

1. If a grower like, say, David Liddle has clone numbers for the different hoyas, is his clone number the only number that that plant goes by, or can some other grower choose to give this same plant a different clone number? In other words, is David Liddle's clone number for Hoya publicalyx "Red Buttons" the only valid clone number in existence?

2. La Pimpette has seven cultivars. http://www.bigislandgrowers.com/ghp/AH/HPub.htm Carol, are the Herbarium specimen Noel #'s the clone numbers for your cultivars?

This message was edited Jun 30, 2006 12:02 AM

My dear lovely friends whose conversations I enjoy immensely, I have a gripe.

I joined this forum (paid my $15.00 and everything) so that I could enjoy the company of people who enjoy their plants, and who wish to share what they have learned with each other. This is the third time, since I joined, that my messages have been forwarded to the moderator of another website who then proceeds to make fun of me.

A while back, after having my threads sent over to be made fun of - I believe the moderator called my threads "a real hoot, baby" - I pointed out that this is a private forum that we pay money to be a part of, and whose postings cannot be read by people who have not paid to be a member of Dave's Garden. According to Dave's Garden Acceptable Use Policy, "Dave's Garden exists to provide an open and safe forum for the discussion of topics that are of interest to the general gardening and homeowner communities, as well as to service those communities with useful and friendly applications. Our goal is to provide an educational and enjoyable experience for all our members..." Can someone please explain to me how having ideas and information that I think might be useful to some (including myself), cut and paste, and forwarded via e-mail to the moderator of another forum - for publication and ridicule - is providing me with an "open and safe forum"? I might add, the other forum is public - meaning, all postings are available for anyone with an internet connection to see.

I am very offended that people on this forum continue to engage in such subterfuge, and I am very much questioning my own intelligence for paying money to a forum where those same people find it amusing, if not enjoyable, to watch one of their own be publicly skewered elsewhere.

This behavior undermines our ability to share with one another and to see each other as real human beings. It certainly has reminded me I need to be more careful who I open up to (and where I open my wallet).

Sadly,
Ann

Ann, I have numbers in my catalogue giving the Assension number I give to my plants. But I use their numbers infrequently. I prefer to give them their IML numbers if the hoya comes from him, because his numbers are known, respected and easier to follow. Assension numbers are just 'tags' to keep, say, H. diptera IML 0000 separated in identity from H. diptera (the one I got at a strange nursery one day).

Someone will probably forward this to another forum and give the HH more fodder for her Nasty Machine.

Carol

Ann - I think we over lapped in our postings.

I totally agree with you. I am short of disgusted to find myself quoted on the 'other forum' and never correctly. If it is the goal of who-ever-is-doing-this to undermine Daves Garden or to undermine any of the members of this forum...I don't care. Stop it!!! PLEASE.

It is obvious to anyone with half a brain cell, that the moderator of the other forum doesn't really NEED anything from this forum as she is content to make up conversations, history and all sorts of trash about anyone at any given time. To feed that Nasty Machine with conversations from this forum is the height of bad taste=trash.

I too am questioning my openess and willingness to share if it is going to be used for this purpose.

With you in sadness...and anger, I might add,
Carol

Ladies, everyone just step back and take a deep breath. I've been around for awhile and after seeing the posts on the other forum I knew it was only a matter of time before bad vibes spread. This always happens....

In an already crazy world all we have are each other and our common bond. Take a walk outside and look up at the sky. One of your hoya sisters is a fraction of a light second away.

Love you all.....be united......

This message was edited Jul 1, 2006 6:04 PM

Amen, sister. Thank you for the wonderful words of wisdom! I am looking up at the sky right now.
Ann

Sorry to hear about Your disappointments.
This forum is still a public place where you may not be save from "low level spies" though those spies have to pay their dues here to see anything beyond the first post in a thread which can be read by anyone.
You can file a complaint with DG staff if You know who the offender is and I'm sure actions will be taken.
Most likely it is just one person who is doing this thus please don't drop down to their level and start conspiracy theories here that just will tear this forum apart.

Milan

Thank you Milan, and do not worry. I know there are no conspiracies here and I certainly do not wish to start something in which we all feel muted and unsafe.

I just wanted to be honest and point out that this was not the first time such postings of mine have ended up on other forums, nor is it the first time those posts have been used for ridicule. I believe such behavior is truly offensive, it is inappropriate, and its repetition is troubling to someone such as myself. I study human behavior and social phenomenon as my career (I am a sociologist), so while I am not surprised by this type of thing happening now and again, I am troubled by the number of times it has happened in the year's time I have participated in this forum - one time can be discounted as inandvertant error, but more than that indicates patterns of behavior that can become stifling to those of us who wish to engage in friendly communication.

So, to end this thing before more bad feelings come of it. I want to state that I DO NOT believe there are any conspiracies of people intentionally spying and attempting to subvert our lovely forum! I do, however, believe there are foolish people with no discretion nor understanding of how their behavior hurts others. Maybe this posting will assist in their realization that their actions do hurt others and they will cease engaging in such behavior.

Finally, let's not waste any more time on this. I am rather sorry I posted my original, unhappy, post regarding this issue. I do not wish for one of the last spaces on the planet where there are not bombs, famine, disease, or hatred, to become a war zone with aggressors and victims - because then we are all silenced.

I am sorry I started this and I wish to end it now.

Thanks.
Ann

I just got back here & started reading this thread & this sickens me.
I don't know what the heck is going on with this cross posting to another forum, but just wanted to assure you that whoever it is that is doing that...IT ISN"T ME.
I wish I knew who it was, I would tell them a thing or two about friends and backstabbing.
I also enjoy (or did) the privacy that this forum has. Guess we can never be sure of anyone anymore, huh?
I really don't understand why anyone would make fun of anything said here anyway. It's all good stuff and great info. They just need to get a life, or like Susan said...go out & look up at the sky more often.
I would never do anything like that to anyone here, I LOVE all you gals (& guys too).
Marcy

Ann, I am sorry that this has happened again. How do we know for sure if they are being passed on, and this person isn't a member of DG. I know that alot of people hide behind victitious names. Could that be a possibility?

Well said, Susan...

Let's put this to bed, OK? Why generate more satisfaction for other people...

Carol

NOW WE RETURN TO OUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAM....TaDAH.......

Please....let's return.

(what WERE we talking about?)...Oh yeah...clones!!!

Famished gotta eat...back later.

C

MsKitty,Don't feel bad......Yes theres spys all over...Look at it this way they gotta go looking for topics to talk about....isn't it sad that they don't have enough to chat about that they have to go looking?????

Feel honored you sparked ole salty dawg......Somebody needs a muzzle!!!!
We all enjoy eachothers post and I know from where I'm sitting you guys sure make me feel good.....It's just the best we have so many members and keep growing!!! Plus we have the best hoya growers around,We are learing and we are blooming them babies!!!!! What more can we ask for???
I enjoy your post You Grow Girl!!!!

Dianne

So anyway... Those numbers are David Liddle's acquisition numbers. The IML stands for Iris Marie Liddle, David's wife. Since David is probably the foremost authority around on Hoyas and sells them as well, lots of people use his acquisition numbers as a point of reference. When other dealers, such as Smoley's, who obviously buy from David as many of the descriptions are veritably the same, buy David's plants they often give the plant their own acquisition number and use that in their own catalog. It would probably be less confusing for all if they used the IML numbers in their catalog and saved their own acquisition numbers for in-house use. It just goes to show you how something meant to organize things can get out of hand, as everyone ends up using their acquisition #s in their catalog and people start assuming that that is part of the plants true and only identification.
That being said, I think we should use the IML numbers as a point of reference, though only if the plants come from David Liddle or a reputable grower who passes that number on to buyers. All motoskeis, for example, would not correspond to Liddles IML 149, as the plant has been collected from the wild many times, and each plant that came into David's possesion of it would have a diferent acquisition number. The IML number represents one particular clone (genetic individual, such as you or I) of a plant.

Well said, Mark.

Annnnnnnd - the different IML numbers for one species indicates the differnt clones of that one species...some of which are ssp. but others are simply 'just another pottsii' for instance. There are numerous H. verticillata, pottsii, erythrostemma, macgillivrayii, australis, lacunosa...on and on. But the, for instance, H. diptera I got from a local nursery does not have an IML # ONLY THE H. diptera I BOUGHT FROM LIDDLE does. It is fun to see a pot of H. pottsii, or erythrostemma or H. lacunosa and see they are all the same species... It is sad that Bob Smoley doesn't keep the IML #...it is hard to trace some of his labels without it.

I was asked by David to use his IML# as part of the indentification of the plant. I agreed to. Other than his, I use their origens and who they came from in my own records...it is a good idea.

Thanks Mark and Carol!!! This really helps.

OK, so the plants that I have listed that came with an IML number that I purchased from the Pimpette are from Liddle and I will keep that accession number with the name. If I have a publicalyx, etc. that came from someplace without an accession number, then I do not attach the Liddle's IML accession number to it.

Finally, however, when someone like Carol has new plants published as a Herbarium specimen (like Carol's Noel #'s), is that the accession number for that cultivar? For example, Carol published H. cv. Sunrise as Herbarium specimen Noel #002. Will I list my plant as H. cv. Sunrise Noel 002?

Thanks so much for providing such good clarifications.

Ann

The only plants I have with numbers or ANYTHING else besides the name came from Carol and a few from Norma. Most of mine just had the name (and sometimes the WRONG name..ha ha)

I always keep all the info on the tags that came with it, plus I try to put on the back who I got it from. I notice the same plants from different sources will a lot of times be a bit different from each other. I have carnosas that are a LOT different from each other coming from different places.

I also keep a notebook (actually several as I have one for sansevieras and hibiscus also) with all the details of the plants like when & where purchased, size, bloom dates, etc.
Marcy

Some plants from Liddle comes with an IPPS # or and HSI # etc....that is 'code' to David where that plant came from. I just keep the IML#s and the other information on my tag or a lose sheet of paper floating around my desk!!!!

No, cultivars don't necessarily have numbers...those Herbarium #s mean nothing. Since there is only one cultivar of one cross that carries the name...there is no mix up, or there shouldn't be. cv. Monette and cv. Isabella (not published) come from the same grex (litter) but they are totally different.

This help?