Is there a thread where I might locate info on what NOT to have around chickens, such as stuff that might be poison or harmful to them, if ingested.
And, my Bantam hens are laying eggs and they want to set, but they cannot seem to get to it, they continue to move around, without seeming to know which eggs are theirs, they are more interested in staying very near Chicken Little, the rooster...the three hens and rooster sleep in the same house each night, is that the way it should be??? Also, I have wormer but do not know how much to give and how to make sure they get it. Thanks!!
Directions and, or a chicken question
here is the poisonness list:
http://www.poultryhelp.com/toxicplants.html
can't help you with the other stuff, i am new, but look forward to seeing the answers. one question though, do you WANT them to set?
i use herbs for natural worming, so can't help you with that either. i am guessing you have piperizan, and it goes in the water, should give ounce per gallon on the label...
welcome to Dave's Garden!
tf
Thank you so much Tam!! I'm into my 3rd year on DG, but I never explored much but the brug forum until recently, and by accident, and now I'm hooked on several forums. First, please tell me about the natural worming you use, if it works, I'm for that. Also, how would one know if they have worms, need worming. I have a giant chicken yard and the chickens, amazingly, are not messy, I've never even seen a dirty egg. I do know about the poison plants, and would have no way of stopping them eat many of them; however, they have been around very poison plants, brugs, oleander, etc, since they were hatched (with lady who raises pure bred chicks, etc.) and here and that was nearly a year ago, so I'm too concerned about the plants, but other stuff like Epsom Salt, lime, moth balls, etc - NO, I do not plan to use or give them this stuff, but some is already in the ground, and I wonder if chickens avoid stuff that doesn't taste good or that smells badly?? Thanks!!
Good questions. I'll be watching to find answers also. Thanks for asking.
Hi Peg. I have chickens that have to blend into rural city life, and already established yards, flower beds, etc. They are doing great, but I fear them getting out, which happens occasionally, like when a limb fell on their fence and there then were 6 chickens roaming the neighborhood, but all ended well. However, if the same thing should happen again, and my neighbor has used Epsom Salt on his plants, I wonder if the chickens eat it what will happen. I'm most fortunate that my neighbors love the chickens and they would never intentionally do any harm to the chickens, but you can see how something like that could happen. Thanks for your post...
my nieghbor doesn't have a clue about poisoness plants. she has many times fed them apricots etc, and they just pick out the bugs and leave the fruit, so i would say chickens are pretty smart about not eating something they shouldn't. i don't think epsom salts could hurt them in small amounts.
i belong to a group where one of the officers is experimenting with natural and herbal remedies and preventive care. one thing she recommends, for overall general health and worms, is apple cider vinegar, with minced garlic clove infused in one liter, added an ounce per cup of water. my guineas did quite well on that, and i plan to use that for my chicks.
as far as worms, there are many types of parasites. i will find the link later and post it here, where they are described. sometimes you may not see signs of them until they are infested badly, but cleanliness is part of the prevention, and checking your birds regularly for signs.
let's see, been a while since i had wormed the guineas, but it seemed like i sprinkled some sort of herb on their feed, it may have been thyme, i will look into that for you, i need to know again too! the lady in the gorup gave a nice list of other herbs and teas you could use, either sprinkle in their food or mix in their water...
i will tyr to get the info for you tomorrow. i have 73 peeping little day old chicks, so i need to sleep when they sleep, which would be now LOL
tf
OMG!! 73 peeping chicks, whew, congrats!! We are expecting 3 soon. What do you feed the babies, is there a special food??
Please tell me the signs of parasites in chickens. I have huge property and 10 chickens, total. I've never had parasites in any of my animals. I think the size of my property helps. I do feed garlic to the chickens but not on a daily basis, I guess I will start that. Thanks for the info, good luck with the little peepers...
Tamara, that is very interesting about the apple cider vinegar. We have been taking apple cider vinegar lately for our human health!
I read something a while back abut a chicken farmer in one of the Asian countries that had some avian flu in his flock and he gave his chickens their Asian version of our saurkraut and most of his chickens recovered. I don't know all the details, but their version of our saurkraut was basically cabbage and vinegar and seasonings.
For the past few months, whenever we have brats and kraut, I give the leftover kraut to my chickens and they love it! I think it is easier to feed them the kraut then to add vinegar to the waterer, unless you think adding vinegar to the water also aids in keeping the water clean.
I am also very interested in hearing what other homeopathic remedies you use on your flock!
Cindy
many use diatomaceous earth as a natural wormer.
That is interesting Zeppy. Any special brand or kind of DE, or is it all the same??? I guess I'll have to make a trip up to Tyson to find out the symptoms of parasites, however, mine appear perfectly healthy....fluffy, clean and fat...
Food grade, not the kind they use for pools. I get mine from Countryside Natural Products, but they're near me.
I wonder if the coops would have the one or similar one to yours?? How do you give it??? I'm wondering about grooming the chickens, like baths. I groom my dogs and I've groomed cows, horses, Alpacas for show, and I know they have chicken shows. I think I'll try it with my grands, won't hurt, I don't guess...
Chickens groom themselves: they must have access to dirt in order to dust themselves or they can get infested and ill and unhappy. I always add a cup or so of diatomaceous earth to their dusting area (holes they make in the dirt) to be sure they are lice and mite free. My layer feed also contains d.m.
Watching chickens take dust baths is one of the great hilarious pleasures of life.
Thanks! Only 72 now ;-(
i looked for that link last night and didn't find it, but i think i can now. also, yes, i think it helps keep the dish clean. everyone in the group who used it noticed that! it just doesn't keep them from getting feed in it LOL. i also noticed the mice didn't care for it at all!!! remember this isn't vinegar that you clean with, this is Apple Cider Vinegar, and the more natural [cloudy, unfiltered], the better! My guineas loved the taste of it. Others had birds that would rush over to get the bits of apple and garlic out to eat first.
The guinea group i belong to discourages the use of DE. If you like, i can find their reasons, then you can decide from there. I recall it is dangerous for humnas to handle, dont' recall the danger to the birds... of course Zeppy mentioned food grade from a natural product source, i have no idea about that.... more info Zeppy?
oh, yes, you give them a chick starter. you need about 100 pounds per chick for hte first ten weeks, then you chnge them over to other rations. some say to use the medicated one, some don't. since this is my first flock, and everything i'm using is new, then i don't see the point in it. it does not establish and immunity to coociodosis, just prevents early death from it. they could still get it later on. my brooder is pretty much free from outside dust particles, so they should be fine.
i got up with the chicsk several times in the night. but this morning i slept till 8:30 [me and the floor just don't get along] and got in there to catch one taking it's last breath. it fell asleep under the heat lamp and stayed there too long. everyone else is fine! 24 Rose Combed Brown Leghorns, and 48 Buckeyes!!! i will start a thread and post pics after supper. meanwhile, let me go get that parasite thread. it is a long read, from a univestiy site...
tf
One of many sites with info on this:
http://www.gardenharvestsupply.com/productcart/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=&idproduct=39#details
What I like best about this stuff (dm) is that it kills insects by wearing their exoskeleton away: it "scratches" them to death physically, not chemically. They can't develop resistance to it.
thanks Zeppy! Yes, we loved watching our guineas take dirt baths. Never heard of it in the feed, but am i so new it hurts LOL
will post the parasite stuff after supper! if i dont' get lost in chick land again... ;-)
tf
Anyone know of a place that sells human grade DE and accepts paypal?? Also, what makes human grade DE different from other grades of DE?? With human grade H202, the difference is the strength and it costs more...
Sherry, a great place that sells both food grade de, natural wormer for poultry and accepts pay pal is,http://www.theholistichorse.com/ sorry I haven't quite figured out how to insert a hyperlink yet. Check them out . I have been very happy with the products.
here is the link for poultry illnesses, a list of symptoms, that also links to what is wrong...
http://archive.msstate.edu/dept/poultry/diagext.htm
this is a diseased list that includes worms, and when you click on it, it takes you to a description and what to do about it:
http://www.msstate.edu/dept/poultry/dislist.htm
if you need a vet in an emergency, it's good to know where to find an avian vet. Vets do not learn about birds in school, unless they specialize in it:
http://www.aav.org/vet-lookup/
this may be overkill, but here is some help with what to do with foot problems, esp with new chicks...
http://www.guineafowl.com/fritsfarm/guineas/problems/
hope this helps somebody...
tf
Thanks, js, I added the source to my bookmarks and will make an order, soon as I know exactly what I'll need. Do any of you know what the difference in regular DE is, from food grade DE?? Now I'm off to read the sites Tam sent, and thank you!!
Oh yes, I failed to mention this. My neighbor and I were chatting and she told me that right before the hubby's mom got her chickens last year, that she, the neighbor, had heavily treated her yard with fire ant granules. Well, turns out that the chickens got out and into her yard several times, and the ground was covered in the fire ant stuff. No problem to the chickens. Is that unusual? I would have thought the chickens would have fallen over dead. I will appreciate any info you might have. TIA!!!
I wouldn't have eaten the eggs after that.
Just a small excerpt from www.safe2use.com
"Both swimming pool grade and natural diatomaceous earth come from the same fossil sources but they are processed differently. The natural grades are mined, dried, ground, sled and bagged. The pool grade is chemically treated and partially melted and consequently contains crystalline silica which can be a respiratory hazard. Thus, IT IS IMPERATIVE THAT ONLY NATURAL DIATOMACEOUS EARTH BE USED FOR INSECT CONTROL. This noncrystalline silica is not a hazard as the human body apparently can dissolve it."
Z, we didn't have eggs then, they were very young chickens, all the more unusual, to me, I would think the fire ant granules would really have been bad for young chickens. The grew up into absolutely beautiful, apparently very healthy chickens. Mine are Bantams which I selected because they are so friendly and cute and because they cannot get out of our enclosure, they are separate from the big chickens. However, in my area, there is always a possibility of a washed away fence or limbs breaking and knocking down or opening a fence or winds blowing fences down. Z, have you or anyone you know had a chicken die of what you thought might be some kind of poison?? My neighbor with the fire ant granules told me that there would be birds dead all around us if the fire ant granules hurt them, it's used freely in this area. The only dead bird I've seen, is one that flew into the window...
js, I located the site, but there is no search and I have not located a product that says DE, but there is a lice/mite powder. Is that the product you mean? If not, which one should I try?? Thanks!!
SherryLike, even Murray McMurray Hatchery now sells natural de-wormers. www.mcmurrayhatchery.com
My chicken feed has DM in it, I add DM to their dusting place, and I also put it in their little coop to keep bugs out. Every few months I use the duster (dustin mizer) to dust the chickens with it too, but I don't think it's necessary: they do a much better job themselves.
My birds ate those iron phosphate Sluggo pellets. I about screamed when I saw them. They ate them like candy: no ill effects. I haven't had any die of poison, and they ran crazy digging in my lily-of-the-valley beds, too. I also grow four o clocks, foxgloves and other poisonous plants like datura... never had a problem.
Oh, Zeppy, the words I wanted to hear!!! Thanks so much!! I'm going to do exactly what you do. I have all those poison plants and others and so do my neighbors, there would be no way to remove everything. Your info really helps....
Just my experience, Sherry. I hope the same is true for you. My chickens no longer have free range of the yard, though I do love to see them wandering around it. They can just ruin a flowerbed in about five minutes. No joke. Bulbs kicked out of the ground and everything. And what they do to veggies... shudder. They of course prefer bugs over everything else, so I will let them out to do Japanese beetle control for a short while every day, but that's it. Wait, you have banties, right? MUCH easier on the yard. :)
I'm also using them to help me (maybe) with the evil cucumber beetle. Because the beetle loves amaranth even more than cucumbers, I am planting a crop of it in their yard, and will keep it covered w/ row cover or chicken wire until the cucumber beetles get active. Then the cover comes off, and the chickens can eat all the amaranth and cucumber beetle they like. I have thought about hanging a Japanese beetle trap over their yard, too, but I feel like those traps bring beetles from far away to my yard.
Yep, Zep, banties, but my hubby's 92+ year mom has regular sized chickens, in their own yard. I spent much of last week chasing them as they were determined to roam. I was forced to clip their wings, something I did not want to do, but Nanah adores them and I could not risk a set back for her if one was killed or injured. Last year, when she got hers, one got out and a red shouldered hawk swooped down and killed it, and we have other rural city varmints, fox, etc. So, if they get killed, it will happen while they are in the pen, that's the best I can do................OTOH, my little sweethearts are so easy too manage and they do not get out, except for one 'wild' Bantam that can fly; however, she is so in love with the rooster, that she doesn't not leave his side, he takes care of his girls and I house them each night and have lights on all of them. I intend to take a couple of the banties each day into my flower beds and let them graze - that is, I'm going to do that if it ever dries up...
I was talking to my neighbor who has chickens the other day. We were discussing mice in the pens. His daughter has always raised show chickens etc., so they've had them a long time.
Get this ! !!!!........ He told me that he puts out mouse poison in his pens and says he always has. I was horrified that the chickens would eat it. He laughed and said, "No, it dosen't hurt them at all. They eat it, but somehow it processes in their crop and dosen't hurt them."
I guess he's never lost a chicken to it. BUT, neither will I, because it just sounds too risky to me. I'm just passing this along as information that he told me. I would never be able to do that, I'd be too afraid. Also, it couldn't be good to eat the eggs, even if it didn't hurt the chickens.
But, I suppose it's possible that chickens do have tolerance to some things.
Zeppy, I'm like you, I would have screamed to see what they had eaten.
I hear the exact same story re the rat/mice poison from local chicken owners in this area. Why do the mice get into the chicken areas, to eat the chicken food?? We have cats that might help with the mice. We thought our cats were going to harm the chickens, but that didn't work out, they became friends instead - the cats sleep in the nests in the hen house with the chickens, when it rains. Who knew?? I learn something new every day...
Sherry, the DE is located in the people section on the holistic horse website.
Thanks, js!!! I should have realized human grade would be in the human section, duh!!
www.countrysidenatural.com
Diatomaceous earth is $25 for 50lb food grade. They have an 800 number and are very helpful. And they're not new to this stuff; at least one of the older folks there has been farming sustainably as long as he's been around. I get my feed, soil supplements and amendments, fertilizer, and pest control from them.
this is all such good info you all!!! i mean, you'ns LOL
i looked up some natural rememdies, and wrote them down, now can't find 'em!!! here are some of the things to grow or have handy, though i can't recall what for at the moment:
chamomile, parsley, pennyroyal, oil of eucalytpus, oil of cloves, oil of bay. phooey, there are some others. i promise i will go look for it in a sec!
tf
I found DE in Lowe's today. Not a work about what kind it was, human grade or other. But, there were no instructions re wearing a mask to put it out, and the DE I got previously gave lengthy instructions about breathing the stuff, etc. I didn't buy the Lowe's product but do want to see if I can find the human grade locally before I order online. Next, I'll checks the coop when I go back to pick up one more covered food thingy...
I'm new here. I actually found this tread by doing a Google.com search for 'how much vinegar to put in chickens waterer'...and didn't find my answer. Does anyone know the answer? Yes, I know to use Apple Cider Vinegar (with the Mother in it!). I actually drink (and make it) it myself :). The store vinegar is nasty and has been processed (No Mother in it) . The reason I was looking for an answer to the above...I have 50 week old chicks (pullets...25 Red Island Reds and 25 Pearl White Leghorns) from http://www.mcmurrayhatchery.com ...and today I had one Leghorn being pecked on the foot (toe) ...and it was bleeding. Geesh, I go inside for 2 minutes, and then the rest attack this one chick. I took her out and isolated her to her own little area and soaked her foot in 3% Hydrogen Peroxide...for now.
Lowe's does NOT carry Natural DE...they carry the chemical stuff for swimming pools. Do Not buy that for your animals! IF it's Natural DE, it will say so. Actually, Lowe's don't carry 'much' in the way of Natural products at all (at least not here or 3 other stores I have visited in the DFW Tx. area).
There are several interesting articles here on DE (Natural, and the chemical stuff).
http://www.dirtdoctor.com/faq.php?letter=D
I'm a Ground Crew member of Howard Garrett's (The Drit Doctor).
IF you ( a Human) are in a confined area with not much or no ventilation....WEAR a dust mask when you spread this. You don't want to inhale the dust particles. In a well ventilated area, you shouldn't have any problems.
Natural DE is excellent for insect control (as Z [I think it was] stated). Once it gets wet tho, you will have to re-apply it ...it's useless after it gets wet, really.
I actually sprinkle Natural DE on my salads from time to time! IF you put too much on, you will know (and won't eat it!)...LOL.
DJ (North Central [Bridgeport] Texas)
TheNaturalWay101 'at' Yahoo.com
P.S. Someone mentioned that they didn't know how to make the Hyperlink here. All you have to do is type the entire URL out and it will Hyperlink automatically. For instance, if you type only dirtdoctor.com , it won't hyperlink...you have to add the http:// in front of it...then it will hyperlink automatically. :)
This message was edited Jun 25, 2006 2:58 PM