Hi folks:
Some of you may remember, I'd posted on someone else's thread that an unrooted cuttings that I received in April (I think?) has since rooted *and* has a bloom inflo.!
One bloom did 'blast', but 2 others have begun to open! yeeha!
Anyways...the cutting was purchased via an ebay seller, and was stated to be 'Pele's Red'....don't know if that's an accurate name, or not. They were inexpensive, so if not, that's OK.
The 2 blooms that are slowly unfurling are very pale yellow.
Do some red flowers begin as yellow and 'turn' red? I know this happens with other plants/flowers, such as Brugmansias......flowers will open white and gradually turn pink or peach.
Not that it matters....I'm happy!!
I'll take a photo tonight.
Also...this has probably been asked before, but how long does a Plumeria bloom last on the plant? I hope it's at least a day...so I can get that photo!
Does a new bloom (eventually) change color?
Hi Nan, the colors of a plumeria do fade in full sun so a red might fade to pink, and a pink might fade to white, etc. Different cultivars have different resistance to fading; i.e., some fade faster than others. A yellow would not change to red. With eBay sellers, you really have to know who are the good ones because, I'm afraid, there are quite a few bad ones out there. I've compiled a list of good ones and posted it here in this forum, but there are other good ones too. I'm glad it was inexpensive. Some of my friends have paid big bucks from sellers on eBay only to find out much later that what they got wasn't what they paid for.
Plumeria flowers can last for weeks on an inflo. As flowers fade and die, new ones should open. When you get some large flower heads, a tree will appear in bloom all summer long.
Here is a picture of my Tahitian Sunset which shows new and old blooms:
I forgot to add something. There is a strange phenomenon that can occur sometimes. A flower on a just-rooted cutting can sometimes look very different than what the flower will eventually look like on a more mature tree. Seedlings do this too, which is why you can't register a plumeria seedling until you have observed it unchanged for three years. So you may have a yellow flower this year and a darker flower next year. This doesn't happen all the time, but it happens often enough to merit mentioning. That is why people say to hold on to a cutting that you just received for several years before deciding to discard it because it may not produce its true blooms for several years.
Well, Clare...you are certainly a *wealth* of information!
I thank you for all this info, and I'll keep in mind that the flower color *may* be different in the years to follow.
These flowers are rather small, as you had mentioned may be the case in the former post (regarding newly rooted cuttings & blooming) and they most definitely started out yellow...no fading involved.
It's OK, though...I'm still excited/happy to have a bloom at all, no less on a newly rooted cutting (I'm glad it was inexpensive, too, lol!)
I did get a photo this morning...will post it when I get it transferred from the camera.
Oh, BTW, you'd likely know this......is there a 'Pele's Red' out there in Plumeria Land?
Nan, glad I could help. I would love to see a picture of your plumeria flower. Sometimes there are hints in the flower that it will be darker (streaks). How's the fragrance?
I can't find any reference to the name 'Pele's Red.' Pele is the fire and volcano goddess in Hawaii. I checked a few different sources and this link: http://www.plumeria.org/Plant_Names/Named_PlumeriaN_Z.htm
It is probably just a name that was made up by the grower who had an unnamed plumie. There is a woman who sells on eBay known as Sue70 who sells some plumies with the name 'Pele,' but they aren't registered cultivars, and some of her cuttings have had serious insect infestations so I would stay away from her auctions.
Oops...just looked it up,it was 'Pele's Red Rage'....supposed to be "deep fuschia with a gold center" and have a "fresh spicy citrus smell."
The description of the scent is pretty accurate....but not the color, so far!
It does have the gold center, but the outer portion is a pale yellow.
The seller was 'sussafrus'.
Good to know about the seller above.
Thanks again for the great info....will check out the link.
(Still working on getting that photo posted!)
BTW...checked out the link above, and noticed....my other cutting purchased from the same seller was named 'Seashell'....that one's not listed, either!
I'll have to be more careful in the future, I guess, if I'm particular about the true ID!!
This message was edited Jul 19, 2005 12:38 PM
Nan, let me doing some asking around about Sussafrus, and I'll get back to you.
Nan, I couldn't get any info about Sussafrus, but I did find out that Pele's Rage is supposed to be red. My friend just showed me a white that she bought two years ago which was supposed to be Angus Selection #3 (a red) and wasn't. She bought hers on eBay too. Here's a list of reputable sellers. Their ebay name is first, followed by their real name, followed by their forum name:
1000blooms -- Hetty / Dutchlady
4miss -- Carol / Miss
adsutton -- Alisa / adsutton
anymakeormodelalwaysbestprice -- Dennis / Dennis
avideo4u -- James / avideo4u
bassnut-10 -- tropic_will
bigwahine -- Naomi / big_wahine
Camelotshadow -- Shadow
CJBJ -- Carol / cjbj
desiree2208 -- Desiree / desiree
Fishdan -- Dan / plumophile
frangipani*heaven -- Chris / FrangipaniHeaven
frangipaniheavenflorida -- Brad / ncasselberryfla
GILBO300 -- William / GILBO300
IOLEFI -- J / PlumeriaRanch
Islandgrrl -- Annie / islandgrrl
islandmokes -- Suki / nutts4plumies
jazznjava9 -- jazznjava
jdungan98 -- Julie / plumeriagoddess
kitty15525 -- Kristen / Kitty15525
leigirl760 -- K2 (Kristen) / leigirl
LilaMalai -- Ekkarat / Ekkarat
lulu_lolacat -- Cassandra / havanabrowncat
miar -- Gemila / aggie-wife
mups03 -- Jennifer / Jennifer (MPG's owner)
ncasselberryfla -- Brad / ncasselberryfla/frangipaniheaven
njamhour -- Nowal / PlumieShrink
noamchampa -- Noam Champa / noamchampa
opalibra10 -- Sally / opalibra10
Pamalestrom -- Michael / Malestrom
plumeriaguy -- Angus / plumeriaguy
plumeria-lady -- Paula / plumeria-lady
Plumeria_Palace -- Randy / Plumeria_Palace
rtruck -- Robert / rtruck
shmilyaggie -- Carolyn / ljune
Speedy4us -- Janet / Janet705
stattrans3906 -- Becky / beckysue
sugarnspice -- Michele / Majickel
Triciabug2003 -- Trish / Aztecsmom
Tropicalbargainhunt -- Relda
twistedparrot -- Kathee / twistedparrot
Vail4me -- Brent / Vail4me
WER4GZS -- Linda / WER4GZS
wolf111 -- Jean / capini
xoratxo -- Robert / father
I would also add to this list:
HawaiiSandy -- Sandy Lavarias, Jim Little's daughter-in-law
This message was edited Jul 20, 2005 10:04 AM
Clare, that is fantastic information. thanks. I have written the DG admins to see if there was a way to maintain a list of EBay sellers and their rating (just the %, maybe only sellers with 90% and above) for all kinds of plants. Members could look them up and if interested, then they could continue their search on ebay by reading the actual feedback, items for sale, etc.
Your list sort of puts us in that direction
Yes, Claire...thanks so much for that list and the time/effort involved in compiling it!!
The photo I'd taken had way too much white with the flash, so I took another (much better) and will post it today.
The flower is now 'white' with a yellow center. lol!!
Vossner...there are quite a few ebay sellers listed in GardenWatchdog....or were you thinking of a totally seperate list?
If I can 'dig up' Sussafrus' name, Claire...I'll send you a DG mail to see if you're familiar with them.
They were really nice cuttings, and the seller was quite congenial and helpful....sent an instruction paper along.
Glad I could help, guys.
Nan, it's good that the seller was congenial and helpful, but she owes you another cutting, the correct one and the one that you paid for. You should get what you paid for. If you still have her email address, I would email her with a picture of your bloom and tell her that you paid for a Pele's Red Rage. It is unethical to sell one cultivar and deliver another, especially if yours turn out not to be a cultivar at all but a common color. You can probably contact Sussafrus through eBay is you search for the seller's eBay name. I would give her the chance to send you the correct cutting. If she doesn't send you another cutting, I would lodge a complaint with eBay.
Nan, unless I'm not reading right in Gardenwatchdog, how can you tell if somebody is an ebay seller? I stay away from buying plants on ebay because I've read too many horror stories. But if there was a centralized list (Not much different than the one Clare has compiled for plumies) I would definitely feel more comfortable about it. In fact, i'm saving her list so I can use as cross-reference in the future when plumie shopping. But sure would love to have a similar resource for hostas, DLs, tropicals.
I have bought a few things on ebay, but my fingers were crossed very tight until I received my item and so far, so good. I think a list as I've described here in would raise the comfort level of many. JMHO.
You're right, Vossner....some folks do have seperate nursery and ebay names, and an 'ebay name' list would be nice to see!
Clare...I did email that seller just today and nicely stated that despite not only rooting well, but *blooming* - it's not RED!! And...asked if she got her cuttings mixed up, so we'll see what transpires.
Finally...I've got a photo....Not 'zactly red, huh?
I'm still pleased, nonetheless, that I've got a bloom on a cutting received less than 4 months ago!
Nan, that is great that you've got yourself a lovely bloom, but the seller owes you a red so I hope she honors that. Please let us know what response you get. If you don't hear back from her and if she doesn't send you a replacement, please let me know so I can spread the word about that seller for buyers to stay away from her. Conversely, she will help her business repuation if she replaces it. One sign of a red plumeria is new leaves which are red or purple. You'll have to check the replacement for this characteristic.
Nan, I just red that another person had purchased a 'Pele's Red Rage' from her, and her's bloomed white too. Here is the link: http://www.mauiplumeriagardens.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=4196&hl=
It looks like she wrote to the seller (Sussafrus) and got this response:
"Hi-- I'm sorry to hear your Plumeria was not the color you and I thought it was. These cuttings are harvested when trees are not in bloom and marked at harvest.I have no way of knowing if the color marked is correct or not. Usually it is. This cutting sold for 9.99 which is a very low price for a 3 tip cutting of that size with a bloom pod .What do you think I should do?? Thanks, Carmen"
This seller should not sell cuttings that she hasn't seen bloom and also should not sell them as named cultivars when they are not. Some sellers realize that they can get more money for named cultivars than unnamed ones so they make names up or stick a cultivar name to a plumeria. Everyone should avoid buying from Sussafrus in the future. Another seller who is making up names right and left and should be avoided is called "localshopping." Another one to avoid is in Singapore and calls himself "andy_florakingdom."
Aargh...I *swear* I posted here the other day....and my post isn't here!
First of all, thanks, Clare, for 'checking around' and posting on the other forum.
I did email Sussafrus and she replied right back:
< Hi-- Well I'm glad for the good news and the white is the most fragrant--but that's not what you wanted. I personally do not participate in the harvest of the cuttings and the harvest is done when the trees are not in bloom.--So you can see the potential for mis- marking a color!If you wish please resend your address and I'll try again for a Pele's Red.Or I can refund your purchase price and shipping. Let me know what you'd like to do. Sorry about this but this is something I have no control overe as the cuttings are marked at harvest>
We'll see what happens....if she had mailed it right out I would have it by now....but nothing, so far.
Still, as someone who started out with *NO* plumerias, I'm happy enough to have not only a cutting or two, but a ~bloom~ (!) But....
The more I think about it, the more I realize that you and the others are so right!
Misrepresentation *is* forbidden on ebay, and....well....it just plain 'ain't right'!!
As a collector of many tropical plants, I've realized that if this were a misrepresented Philodendron, Ficus, Hoya, etc....I would, initially, have been really upset about it!
With that said, I fully understand that if someone was *specifically* looking for Pele's Red Rage....they would have been terribly disappointed!
The worst part is.....they wouldn't have realized their disappointment until perhaps a year or two had passed (whent the plant would normally bloom).
Even if she'd place a disclaimer stating that she's not 100% positive of the ID's....or list them as 'unknowns' with the possible identitys of X, Y, Z......I still would have bid, and I'm sure others would have, as well, since the price was right.
I'll give it another week, see if she sends another, then email her again if I don't receive anything.
My bloom is just about an exact match to veganbabe's, don't you think?!
Thanks again, Clare!
Nan, I would get a refund of your purchase price plus shipping if she is willing. I'm not sure you can trust what you can from her now.
You are so right in your assessment of the situation. I agree with you completely. It's happened over and over again unfortunately. Some of my friends have payed hundreds of dollars for some rare named plumeria cultivars which were advertised as 'Confettii' and 'Englewood,' only to find out a year or so later that they were sold something else. It is very frustrating for a collector as you said, and sometimes, the seller is long gone by the time the plumeria blooms.
You are also right that it would have been better for her to list that her cuttings are unknown colors and could possibly be white, red, or pink. She would have kept her credibility that way and probably still sold as many as she did previously. I see that she currently has auctions for this one even now. The responsible thing for her to do is to edit her auction to include the disclaimer that you stated.
Yes, your cutting probably came from the same tree as Veganbabe's. It's a very nice white:-)
Clare, thank you for that list. I have a comment about eBay itself. I bought some plants from a seller and received half dead plants, got no reply from the seller so decided to leave a negative comment. eBay won't let you unless you jump through many hoops. Even neutral comments send you through the same route. I finally gave up. I will never buy from her again, but how does one warn other buyers if eBay discourages that?
Betty, I don't understand why you couldn't leave a negative comment. That's what the rating is for: to warn others. If they don't let you do that, then you can't warn others. I would continue to try if you can. We can keep each other informed here as we learn and have bad experiences. Personally, I don't buy from anyone who is not on the list. I know that I can trust HawaiiSandy, Frangipaniheaven, and Bradsbudsandblooms, and those are pretty much the only people that I buy plumerias from on eBay. I personally have gotten so many wonderful plumeria cuttings from Florida Colors Nursery, who sells online but not on eBay, and I think they are the best place to get plumerias from. They have many cultivars which are not listed on their web site so you just have to give them a call if you are looking for a particular one. Their prices are often much better than eBay prices anyway.
Update - though not much to tell!
I haven't heard from or received anything from the seller mentioned above since here last email.
I emailed again today stating that I'd prefer a refund, and I tactfully suggested that she add a disclaimer with a list of 'possible' ID's if a buyer's cutting should be misidentified as mine was.
Will let you know if I hear anything!
Bettydee may have used a seller who's involved in that mediation program, (or whatever they call it)....I think it's called 'Squaretrade'??
It's voluntary, and it's there to encourage sellers/buyers to try to settle their problems. But I thought it was a seperate entity from ebay, so I don't understand either how it would make it 'difficult' to leave a negative feedback?
I've only left two negatives on ebay, that I recall (out of almost 700 purchases) for items that I just plain got 'stiffed' on, and they went through without a hitch, although it has been couple/few years since I left my second negative.
Ah, that explains why Bettydee couldn't leave negative feedback. I haven't heard of that "Squaretrade" before, but that makes sense.
I hope you get your money back from your seller since you didn't get what you paid for. That's only right and fair.