One plant with two types of new growth???

My Epi is showing 2 types of new growth. It's at least consistent. The first type of growth (what I'd expect to see on this plant) comes as new shoots off the sides of existing arms. But the weird growth is very prickly and is growing out of the ends of tips that I'd snapped off several months ago and stuck back into the dirt. I'd read somewhere that snapping off the ends would encourage mroe lateral growth....and since my plant was just half a dozen really long arms, I figured it couldn't hurt. And being the type to never be able to just throw such things away, I stuck those 1 inch tips back into the soil and figured if they rooted, great, if not, no big deal. Well, they all rooted and now 3 of the 4 are showing this weird new growth unlike the growth on the rest of the plant.

Here's a pic of a "normal" little pink growth bud (I've got 18 of these so far that are growing like mad):

Here's a pic of the overall plant....you can see all that new growth. From the floor to the top of the plant is 99 centimeters. The longest arm growing off to the right is 80 centimeters long.....this is why I snapped off those ends!

And here's a pic of a "weird" growth bud about the same age as the previous little pink one:

Here's another of the weird growth buds that has been growing for about a month:

And finally, a pic taken from the top of that last bud so show how multi-sided they are....and they seem to be growing in a sort of spiral:

Some of mine do that from time to time too. Not sure why. It will be interesting to find out if someone here knows!

K

Julie, I have some like that too and so does Candy. We talked about that not too long ago when we were comparing our "weird" ones. Since these are hybrids and have been crossed and recrossed, involving several species, it is probably just one specie's characteristics showing itself. I think you can see three or four different types of growth on one plant, and I think it is because of the hybridization process. Just a guess....

I see that also. I have some cuttings that I got that were three-sided and they are growing flat leaves. Many of my plants put out new growth that is round or many sided and have prickles, eventually most of these become flat. Iile Clare_CA I expect that this represents the mixed heritage of these plants.

Do you get different colored flowers from different shaped "throwback to parentage" leaves?

K

Not that I am aware of, but than maybe time will tell.

I get "odd" combinations of different forms of growth also Julie, but as yet I've not seen different flowers on the same plant.

Sometimes those little prickly growths at the end of a leaf are flowers and sometimes they are just new growth. It is hard to tell when they are very tiny which they are destined to become.

Here are four examples of odd forms of growth. I don't know whether it means they are reverting or it has something to do with growing conditions. I do know that growing conditions like more or less water, heat, light can affect the form that Euphorbias will exhibit.

This first one has some flat leaves with spines, a triangular shaped leaf that then turned flat, and some almost round very prickly forms.

Next are two examples of the growth that begins to spiral as it gets bigger and then sometimes begins to grow as a flat leaf we normally see.

And this one which is trianular, began to spiral, but now seems to be growing as a regular triangular form.

And this is one of those "tip" growths that I was sure was just new growth, when it all of a sudden became a bud. :-)

We were discussing the very same thing here, as Clare mentions.
http://davesgarden.com/forums/t/511085/

I am so glad, all those posts were moved along into the new Forum.

Ursula

Wow thanks for the great feedback everyone! Candy the multiplicity fo growth forms in that first pic is mindboggling......how can so many different forms of growth be from the same plant! LOL That's just wild!

-Julie

Great pics, Candy! Thanks for that illustration:-)

Another question about odd growth... I have lots of cuttings rooting under lights, two of which are very large leaves of an unknown red. One of them is putting out fine roots from the TOP of the leaf. Is this regular behavior? Should I split it in half and stick the top half in the media?

Kathleen

Some of mine put out fine roots like that at the top. In the wild, that's how they attach to trees and climb.

I'd not cut and plant it unless you are aiming for a fuller plant.

I agree with Darius. They get nutrients from those air roots. It could be that they are not getting enough water and nutrients from the soil as well. I definitely would not consider cutting it and potting it upside down!

I'll cast a third vote for leaving it alone and letting it pretend it lives in the jungle with those aerial roots!

Good to know -- I should have remembered about their wild nature! The only reason I thought of it was these leaves are really big -- so much so I imagine I'll have trouble keeping them upright in a small pot. Thanks!

Kathleen

I joined DG a few months ago, and I have been reading the Orchid Cacti forum from the oldest posts upwards so I don't miss out on any flower pictures. I know that since this is an old thread you might know about this by now but I thought you might like to know anyway, that the prickly growth is what you would get if you grew an Epi from seed. In other words it is the juvenile form of the stem. Cuttings or stressed plants also may revert to this growth form. It makes sense if you think about it - if you were a tiny juicy cactus seedling, stuck up a tree in the jungle, you would want to keep your thorns to protect yourself from hungry mouths too! With seedlings in cultivation the "normal" stem growth kicks in somewhere between 6 and 18 months, depending on how strongly the seedlings are growing. I hope this information is of use, Kaelkitty.

Kaelkitty, thanks for your explanation. I have epis that I started from seed in 2003. None have bloomed yet, but I think 2008 might be the year. Most of them are still producing the small juvenile type growths from the bottom of the pot. Is it better to remove these so that more energy can go into the mature parts of the plant?

I'd be more inclined to feed, repot or recondition the soil; than to cut anything off at this stage. How big are your seedlings? I'd read through some of the threads posted here by Happenstance or RUK as they have a lot of good advice. In a general sense, potassium is the most likely bloom accelerator, so banana skins, fish emulsion, seaweed conditioner, or any commercial fertilizer with a high middle number are probably good bets to get the plants on the proper track. Can you post pictures of your seedlings? Most of the posters in this forum are very helpful, and I'm sure they will have plenty of good ideas. Kaelkitty.

Thanks for the reply, Kaelkitty. Here are two of my epis, both from the same seed packet. I am wondering if I should trim the very long branches back (and repot the cuttings) or just leave them alone.

Here is the first one. It has several fat branches with "fins" but is still producing long, skinny branches with spines:

Here is another one. This looks very different from the first, with flatter leaves and less juvenile growth. Do I just let them grow crazy like this, or is it better to divide/ trim/ thin them somehow? Thanks very much.

Louise

Oh Sofi,
If those are typical of your 4 to 5 year old seedlings, I'd say you have got NOTHING to worry about - those are way happy! The plant in the second photo is absolutely normal in every respect as far a I can tell, and I suspect the other one may just have a bit more Aporocactus or similar in it's breeding, to have remained so spiny. I do have one question though - could your plants be getting a bit too much nitrogen and not enough potassium and/or phosphorus? The other possibility is that the plants are, in a sense too healthy! As Happenstance and others on this forum have repeatedly demonstrated, reliable flowering occurs on older, more crowded plants, which have undergone a definite rest period with reasonable winter chill. Often the worse the plant looks, the better it flowers! I'll shut up now, and see what the experts have to say. LOL, Kaelkitty.

posted by mistake

This message was edited Aug 19, 2007 2:47 AM