Seems I was wrong about P. mucronata being the last to bloom this year; found this earlier today.
Passiflora 'Fledermouse' in bloom
Indigo,
I have some "not so good" news. I lost my Gritensis. I had it in a dark room with all of my other plants for the hurricane and it never came back after that. It was sickly and just kept declining. But I did find a friend who has it so I'll be trying to get it again from him. Now this 'Fledermouse' is neat. I don't have this one. If you happen to root some I would love some. I'll still root the others that you lost and hopefully get them out to you before it gets too cold. I hate the season change. The only good thing is less watering I have to do but I wouldn't mind watering year round if I had to.
Oh BTW,
I have never hated butterflies so much until now that I collect passion flowers (not all butterflies). Do you also have this problem Chris? I don't think I remember these butterflies there in Texas. Or atleast not there in your part of Texas and certainly not in these numbers. I bet the neighbors think I've surely lost my marbles when they see me chasing them in the yard swating at them. A friend came over to my house and saw me trying to kill a butterfly a little while back. I don't even think about what I'm doing when I'm doing it. It's become second nature. He walks up behind me and says, "What in God's name are you doing?" I just laughed and told him he wouldn't understand. They hardly discriminate against any passion flower.
Oh, Hugo:-) That is so sad! Butterflies are wonderful in the garden and so gentle. How on earth can you kill them? They don't hardly do any permanent or noticeable damage to Passifloras, and sometimes it is their only means for food. One of the reasons that I even plant passifloras is to attract them.
Clare,
Really, these butterflies remind me of the frogs and locusts from Ten Plagues of Egypt during biblical times. I have friends that come over that joke. They refer to my passion flower collection as my "twig" collection so I know the damage is more than just noticeable. Permanent maybe not but I have a difficult time keeping them alive when they have no leaves like this. The water requirements change practically over night. They tend to not need/use as much water and I lose them to this since I water large scale and not by hand but rather with large sprinklers to water all of them at the same time. I have about 60 passion flowers. There are acres and acres of the native/wild P. incarnata all over this area. So I know that my passion flowers are hardly their only food source. They just like to drive me nuts. I hate pesticides so I have this problem to deal with. I"ve been looking into organic solutions. Maybe BT or predatory mites that would eat the caterpillars as they hatch.
I love insects. Really, I do. I don't think a garden is complete without them. Certainly not my garden. I just like my passion flowers a WHOLE lot more than I like the Gulf frit. I also plant stuff for butterflies but certain things are just off limits. I plant milkweed, fennel dill etc. I even have plans of planting some sweet maple for the luna moth and some citrus for the giant swallowtail butterfly. A bat house, barn owl house and a honey bee apiary are all in the master plan. I'm still trying to figure out what attracts the milipedes. I see them around but not in my garden. In Texas I had them all over. They were the thickness of my thumb in some cases. I just love those things. So you see, I'm not a total bug hater. I'll post a picture of my "vines" or "twigs" as my friends like to call them.
This message was edited Oct 14, 2004 1:17 AM
Here's a shot from above to give you the full effect. You can imagine my frustration when I see Chris and Tropicman posting all of these awesome bloom shots.
Hugo, that's pretty bad bamage:-( I have quite a few of the common gulf fritillary (the orange ones), but I've only had that kind of damage on P. murucuja.
I also have the zebra longwing, which is another passiflora eater, but there are very few of their offsrping about for some reason. Their caterpillars are black & white (and I tend to leave them), as opposed to the orange & black of the gulf.
Normally I shake the entire plant if there's a major infestation, or just knock off most of them, plus I inspect regularly for the eggs (teeny yellowish things) on the smaller plants. They tried infesting my pots of seedlings even, I found them covered with eggs one morning and they were quicky smushed.
I have no problem with any other butterflies, I rather like taking pictures of them.
As for bugs in general, I tend to tolerate most of them, I only spray for mites, whitefly (does very little to them anyway), and/or mealybugs, occasionally I'll spray the roses I have if the blackspot is really bad. Plus I hate mole crickets; I treat when I see that they have been burrowing about. They only seem to live in the front yard though, I have no sign of them in the back.
I also will destroy any fire ants that come along, as well as an annoying species of cut ants that appear sometimes. Last year they made an underground den so massive that it looked like a sinkhole in one of my beds after a heavy rain. I had to bring in a wheelbarrow of soil to fill it in after I dumped pesticide granules into the cavern.
Guess that about covers my stance on bugs:-)
The longwings are neat. I would leave them alone too so long as they aren't taking over completely. I spray for pest insects but I only use the homemade mixtures with soap, oil etc in them. I don't have any ants in my yard. I usually keep them away with just some soapy water poured into their nests. A day or two later they are all gone.
You're lucky that whole the ants had going in your yard wasn't up against your house. You would have had some serious shifting of your house.
I try shaking the caterpillars off too. I can't seem to get into the egg smashing thing. I get the ebeejeebees about it for some reason. lol
BTW
If I was a butterfly I too would pick the murucuja to eat. Now THOSE are some butterflies with good taste.
Oh, Hugo, you are right. That is bad and noticeable. I can see why you need to get rid of them. How could I doubt that you like bugs with your name "BugFreak!" I'm sorry they are destroying your Passifloras. BT does work well on the budworm so it should work on the catepillars too. I think, if I'm not mistaken, that milipedes are bad for the garden but centipedes are good. I forget now. I do like your master plan.
Thanks Clare. Before I collected passion flowers I would always hear people complain about the butterflies. I would tink to myself, "Oh how could the gentle pretty BUTTERFLY be a PROBLEM? I would just let them do as they pleased if it was me." Then I realised how frustrated these individuals were and why once I saw what they could do to a vine. You are right about millipedes. I'm now sure what I was thinking. What I want to attract are actually the centipede. The millipedes bite and can be venomous. The are also insectivores while the centipedes are herbivores. They eat and help decompose leaf matter. They still release an acidic dye-like liquid that can irritate and dye the skin if you miss-handle them. You can usually just wash it off and so long as you don't get it in your eyes or face it doesn't cause much of a problem. I guess they need SOME sort of protection in nature.
I'm encouraged by your comments on BT. The only thing I don't like about it is having to re-apply it. I've been reading about IMP (Integrated Pest Management). It's more like biological warfare on an insect level. You use certain nonpest insects to control the pests. In a lot of cases these methods are more effective control of pests than spraying chemicals. I also like the "hands off" that comes with it. You have to do very little to control these pests once you get things going. What really draws my attention are the predatory mites. There are some that eat aphids, pest mites, caterpillars, cutter worms, scale, mealy bug anda host of other pests. I think these kind of things are absolutely neat. There is a really good book that I want to buy at Timberpress on this topic. I need to read more about this topic to see what will work for me though. We'll see what turns up. I thought the organic forum would have more info on this but I havn't really seen much. Well, Enough rambling on my part.
Hugo, I've heard that wasps are good for insect control as well, and, of course, the lady bug and praying mantis. I bought about 1000 ladybugs in the spring, but most of them didn't stay around. I wish they would have because my artichokes are covered in aphids. The ants are farming them there, and everyday I spray them off, and everyday, the ants put them back! For whiteflies, the only remedy that works is an oil-based product sprayed right on them. For mites, I use Avid, which I purchase online. I also use Neem oil and alternate between the too. Bayer Systemic Insecticide granules works great on mites as well. For mites, it's important to rotate your treatments because successive generations can become immune. Good luck!
There is something I read about that is some sort of fossilized plankton that is used to combat ants and any insects that climbe up the trunk of the plant. These last forever after they are applied around the base of the plant. It's expensive if I recall correctly but it goes a long way and lasts a long time. Just an FYI. Thanks for the suggestions Clare.
Hi Hugo, I think you are referring to Diatomaceous Earth. Here's a link: http://www.eap.mcgill.ca/Publications/eap4.htm I actually have a box, but you have to be really careful with that stuff. If it gets into your lungs, it will stay there forever.
Yes. Sorry, I forgot to mention that about breathing it. Thanks for sharing that. Does it work? I'll read up on it.
Hugo, I'm an idiot. I bought the box of DE about a year ago and have been too afraid to use it. With my luck, I'd not only breathe it in but get it all over myself!