In the picture You'll see 2 Hoyas I recently got. The left one was labeled as H. imperialis which it is not, leaves are succulent and both leaves and stem are densely haired. The right one was labeled H. incana (?), underside of leaves and stems have pubescence, top of leaves are haired to a lesser extend.
Full postive ID will most likely not be possible without flowers but I would appreciate any suggestions on what species they could be.
Milan
The pubescent one on the left definitely not H. imperialis. Could be H. albiflora/H.magnifica/H.calycina...to name a few. No idea about the one on the right...kinda/sorta looks like it could be...a hoya? Where did you get them? Could the one on the right be a seedling of something?
Milan and everyone hello,
I got the exactly same one as you Milan, Now I'm so disapointed that the imperialis is not a imperialis :(
Carmen
With out the flowers how can we dare make a guess. I guess, Australlis one of many.
None of my australis have flowered at this time. Norma
Where did you get them from Milan?
Norma...you are totally correct. Without flowers it is impossible to give a correct ID. But, sometimes, it IS possible to tell what a plant "is not" from the telltale characteristics of the leaves and growth.
Norma, I dared you guys to guess :). A H. australis ssp. was a guess of mine on the right one too, well lets see what the flowers will be.
Both are coming from Pike Lake.
Carmen, also their H. darwinii might not be that species, it looks more like tsangii (DS-70).
Carmen, If I sent it to you, it is a Imperials. I forgot what I sent at this time.
Carol Noel you may be correct but for me, I need to feel them, see them up close and personal, and I need the flowers. I was fooled on the Crassula once, not again, when it flowered it was a C. sp. nudicales and not a C. pubescens v. radicans. all because of the punduncle. The leaves are identical. None of us have the expertise, I just wonder how many of us started more than 3 years ago, three years certainly don't make us experts. I can't get close enough to the picture. Norma
Please describe the leaves more thoroughly, it looks to me tjat the one on the left is fuzzy or suede like, on both sides of the leaf, or only one one side. The light green one I have as well, but lost the name tag. They both look like forms of Australis to me, but so do the rest of them I have. Count the side veins for us and the way it joins the stem, on the back side as well, length of stem please. Does the spine (nerve)? go all the way down to the apex of the leaf? Norma
How long are the leaves, I notice that one tips back. and that the nerves joins the spine alternately and not opposite. Then I think Carol Noel will know what it is. Give the lady a break please. Norma
We agree, Norma. Impossible to tell what IT IS without the flowers...but I can tell you that I have never heard of (in my short but intensive study of Hoya) a pubescent H. imperialis...
As for the one on the right...I would guess H. australis...but it could be a seedling, another species...
Doesn't sound like Pike Lake is too careful.
Aloha
Aloha Carol,
well Pike Lake is a small family, mailorder only GH. I guess they received their plants mislabeled (surprise surprise) and kept the names, but at least one gets nice looking plants.
I'll call the owner and see what he has to say about the imperialis.
Norma, the left one has leaves that are densely covered with pubescence on both sides. I'll give the other characteristics once I'm at home with the plant in my hand.
Break? These days breaks are luxury items :)
Milan
Milan, You are so right the plants from Pike lake are very healthy.
Norma , I did not received it yet, as you know it did a detour to the states ;) But I think it was another one, not a imperialis, will let you know when it gets here, mail has not passed yet today :)
carmen
Hi Milan,
Just a side note to the wrongly named "Imperialis" from Pike Lake. I had ordered one for my mom back in Sept. '03 that looked exactly like the one you posted on the left. She couldn't keep it going through the winter time. When i did a pic search on it, the real H. Imperalis' pics that I searched for on the internet didn't match what hers looked like from Pike. I think another wrongly named one on his list is the Purpureo Fusca which is a Pubicalyx "Pink Silver".....I have to agree with Carmen that Pike Lake's plants are full and the service is very good. Hope yours blooms for you Milan, it would be interesting to know what both of those really are.
Sandy
I hate to be so negative, but I looked all of last night. I still guess they may both be Australis, it is so variable. I also have a light colored leaf one. The leaves being an apple green. Norma
Carole Noel, this name bit is driving me nuts. Keep the old name that they were, so what if they weren't published properly. It was the first name it was the first name , and it should stay. I just don't want to be confused. Baaa Humbug. Norma
You are not alone, Norma...I am generally in a constant state of confusion, myself!!! If a name is invalid and I have the correct name, I change it. Or, I give my plants a Number which means the ID is uncertain. Or I forget the whole thing, pour a glass of Shiraz and watch a movie. The latter is much more fun!
Well I talked at length especially about the imperialis with Tom from Pike Lake Greenhouses.
According to Tom he got the mother plant years ago from Roehrs Greenhouses (or Roehrs Co) in NJ as Hoya imperialis. As per Tom there's a book from Roehrs (Exotic Plant Manual I believe) which states that Hoya imperialis "has downy hair on leaves and stem".
Anybody here has that book from Roehrs and can provide me with a scan or the full text in regards to Hoya imperialis?
I guess I'll jump in the maw of the Lion and post at MSN about it ;).
Milan
Milan, I know that there is more than one form, variety? of 'Imperials' is this a species, where did the name come from. I
I'm searching, I'm giving a program tonight so don't have much time today, but I sure want to know. I know one of mine has wavy leaves, that are a good size and stiff. Now I must fine the other, they are different. Have'nt seen the flowers, so I don't know yet. Norma
OKay the one I'm looking at is suede to the touch, the borders are crimped or wavy, the apex is pointed and turns down to catch the drops of water from the mist. Mine says Im,perialis from TOC, Borneo This is not a glossy leaf. Does this match the one to the left.
The longest leaf is 7" from the main vine. Some leaves curl with not a straight spine. They are two and three quarters wide at the fullest part of the leaf. It is growing like a weed. Milan if you can identify my 40 plants with lost labels, you would be welcome to stay with us for a week. I don't have jealous husband. LOL
Any one else wants to volunteer? Now you don't know if I seriouis of not, all inquiries accepted. Norma
The leaves on this one are rather thick (succulent) and edges are not wavy. Top and Bottom of leaf is densly haired, velvet like. I will provide a close up pic of veination later on.
Norma, I tell you what I tell my Manager when he comes up with these impossible jobs for me:
"If I could work this magic then I would be rich by now and wouldn't need a job anymore". :)
Milan
Here's the close-up of the leaf which shows the alternating venation.
Milan, your leaf looks a lot like my hoya Calycina, and has the same features as you described.
Blessings,
Awanda
It also shows the real shape of the leaf getting wider as it goes to the apex. then pinching in sharpely. I found my second 'Imperials' no fuzz, suade, hair, smooth, but not shiny. Wavy borders yes, no flower yet.
Okay, CarolNoel you are right it is not an 'Imperials' no way near it. Now can all of you help me. I don't have a picture, but I will take one tomorrw.
I was water and guess what I found? I think it may be a H. burtoniae. The corolas are dusky rose, the crown consists of butter yellow with a rose dot in the middle, they are a total of 3/8 " in size and the corola curls back. The whole bunch measures about 1.4" across, and minutely fuzzy, the leaf a little over 3 inches and at the widest 3/4 " Norma
Tomorrow I will take pictures of my 2 H. imperialis. One is H. imperialis ssp. rauschii (spelling may be off)...the other is H. imperialis from Palawan. Today I saw the flowers of the Palawan species and it blew my socks OFF! 3" across...white with pink smudges. What really yanked my chain is that I gave the cutting to a friend who grows it further down the mountain where it is about 6 deg. warmer, he grows them in the sun with awful soil. His bloom like the dickens! Give me a sec. and I will post the flowers.
The H. imperialis ssp. rauschii is very slightly pubescent...sort of like H. australis ssp. keysii is...but not at all like the leaf in Milan's photo. I agree with Awanda that it could be H. calycina....but need to see MORE leaves as it could also be H. magnifica or H. albiflora (or the mystery I have as that).
TTFN
Sorry...I meant to add that the H. imperialis from Palawan has very smooth leaves (glabrous...I don't know...will tell you tomorrow) but the margins are NOT wavy. The H. imperialis ssp. rauchii has wavy margins.
Seems like I am going to have to post this in 3 stages. Here is H. imperialis ssp. rauschii...you can see the leaf...flower is deep red.
OK..here is H. imperialis from Palawan...(OMG, the size of that flower is daunting!!)
And here, for fun...are the two flowers together....ooops, forget it...next one has the flowers.
This message was edited Aug 17, 2004 10:00 PM
eh, voila
I do have another H. imperialis I got from Paul Shirley which has relatively smooth leaves with very little pubesence. The leaves on this one have the imperialis trademark waved edges but the leaves are small compared to others seen on the web. It grew like grazy during the last winter but was kinda dormant the last few month and finally started to get some new growth recently. No flowers though.
Aloha Carol (not Dixie Carol :), I know you have your own website where you post your pictures but I would really appreciate if you could post some of your georgeous H. imperialis pictures (among others :) in the PDB here.
I guess the Hoya in question here will remain a mistery until it flowers or if , by remote chance, I find someone which got this one from Roehrs or Pike Lake, had it flower and figured out its true identity.
Milan
This message was edited Aug 18, 2004 2:52 PM
Have been feeling remiss about that, Milan. Will do.
Hi Milan and Carol Noel, I have a Australis sp nova, which means new, it is the light green color, it's a dead ringer for the above photo you sent. This is slight velvet. I think I would consider it glabous. No flowers but growing rapidly at this time of year. Each leaf seems to be slightly different. No distinguishing features yet. What do I look for?
Norma...I hate to say this...but H. australis IS a sp. (species) so it can't be sp. nova. Where did you get it?-that would start the search. MM used to put "nova" on anything he had never seen before...others put it on something they don't know what it is... If the leaf is "slightly velvety"..try looking at the leaves with a loop/magnifying glass. Sometimes the hairs ARE there, just widely spaced and short so the light shines thru the hairs and hits the surface of the leaf, making it look glabrous...but it really isn't. Sounds like it COULD be a seedling of something...Do you have a picture?
Thanks for the correction, I thought nova, meant new, which it may have been at the time collected. bit no longer. It may not be named yet, that is what I was looking for, has it been named at this time.
Norma
The type of Hoya imperialis does not have the typically wavy leaves but what you have is not Hoya imperialis.
My guess (only a guess) is that the one on the left in your picture is Hoya calycina and the one on the right (again a guess) is Hoya australis subsp. australis.
Chris Burton
Thanks for the input Chris.
