OK, my turn to share 1st Bloom!

Hi, All -

I know I don't post much..but I follow the forum all the time. Thought you would like to see my first blooming Brug - It's Jean Pasco - given to me as a "stick" last November from Diana Grunman. Jean is LOADED with buds - the other one is Dr. Seuss, who looks very healthy, but nary a sign of a bud yet. Anybody wager a guess when it will start? I feed these things every 2 weeks with alfalfa pellet tea. I swear by that stuff now for all my flowers. Ain't she pretty??

The other stick I got was Insignis Pink, but alas, she never rooted. I hope to get another Insignis Pink sometime..

Diane

Diane,They look Great!!! you are a great Brug Mom,so good to see you and your Brugs!

Jean P is looking great. Nice big blooms. No guess here on when the other one will bloom. Soon, I hope.

aw shucks Rootdoctor..from you that is a real compliment. I sure have grown to love these babies as I watched them grow. The smell on these flowers is just heaven. You can't see it in this picture, but to the right of me are about 15 Daturas I have grown from seed this year. All are loaded with buds now. I'll try to find a picture to share with y'all.

Why don' t you post more Diane? Your Jean Pasko is to die for! Such incredibly huge blooms.

Very nice to meet you!
Kell

Gosh!! Those are huge! Congratulations on your 1st bloom! Your plants look wonderful!

Thanks, Diane, I've never seen Jean Pasco - yours is beautiful, your place is wonderful and your hair is to die for!!! If I could have any color I wanted, I would go with yours!!!

Wow, what beautiful huge blooms.

Both are very nice, healthy looking plants.

Beautiful blooms! Congrats on those first blooms!

Congratulations Diane! The flowers of Jean Pasko are beautiful!!!

They look great and I know how you feel at first bloom. Congratulations.

Hi Diane, you are doing a great job. I just started with Brugs last summer and I have 10 plants this year. I don't have any buds, yet, they are just growing. I finally found some alfalfa pellets today and hope you will tell me how to make a tea for my plants. Thanks, George

KRNYSGIRL, Great picture, such beautiful large blooms and you look great with them. Donna

WOW if my JP looked like that i would be so proud !! She just will not atke off and do well, I may have to move her.

Wow, you sure must be doing something right.... those are beautifulll and humungous too.... Thank you so much for sharing with us..

Blessings,
Carolyn

Good job Diane - your plant looks great! I just got Jean Pasco this year, it's got 2 buds now. I hope mine eventually looks as nice as yours.

Hi Diane:

Congratulations on your first blooms. They are beautiful.

Thanks all for the nice comments -

Poorgeorge - here is how I make my Alfalfa Pellet tea. I took a large tub (holds 22 gallons of water). I put 2 cups of the alfalfa pellets for every 5 gallons of water in the bottom and fill up the tub with water. I let it sit overnight and the pellets turn to mush by the next day. Now here is where my way is different than others - I was originally told to let it "brew" for one week and then water the plants with it - but if you do that the fermentation process makes the tea smell to high heaven - yuck! So I don't wait - the next day, I stir the pot so it mixes the mush with the water and I start watering my plants. (I use two gallon milk jugs with the spouts cut out and I just dip them in to the tub and fill them - using them to water the plants). When I get to the bottom 1/3 of the tub where it is solid alfalfa mush, I put the hose in it and fill it back up with water, stir it again and keep watering. I do this till all my plants are watered and I have used up all the mush. There is no foul oder doing it this way..it smells like hay, actually. Sometimes if the mush is thick it will form a crust on top of the plant soil. After a day when it has dried out, I take a hand rake and break it up a little and work it into the top layer of soil. When I first tried this 5 weeks ago, neither of my brugs had any buds - within 48 hours of applying this - Jean Pasco put out her first 4 buds and is still forming new buds every day. My wave petunias went crazy too and have cascaded down a foot over the sides of their pots too. I swear by this stuff now.

Diane

Hi, Krnys, and grats on your fantastic brug. I, too, swear by the alfie tea and I, too, don't think it has to stink. In fact, what I hear is that if it smells bad it means it has gone anaerobic, and an anaerobic brew can actually do harm to your plants.

My formula is similar to yours, except I use 1/2 C per gal, and I add a little yeast and molasses. The molasses feeds the bacteria, and the yeast hastens the fermentation. I let it brew for 2-3 days, and I stir it at least once a day to keep it aerated. It doesn't smell bad at all. I also don't think covering it tightly is a good idea. It needs air but not light, so I leave a little corner of the tub open. (Mosquito larvae cannot possibly mature in 3 days.) I also strain some and use as a foliar spray on container plants in addition to their soil drench.

BTW, I put the water out a day ahead to let the chlorine evaporate, but this isn't essential--not enough chlorine in potable water to kill very much of such a large colony of organisms. (I've also read that a little Tang will neutralize the chlorine, and then you can use the water right away.) For the sediment left after dipping off the tea, I add more water straight from the hose, a little more alfalfa, yeast and molasses, let it brew another day and then use as an all-over application for between plants and for a bed I'm readying for next year. It adds great tilth to soil. If you have access to good compost or manure, a shovel of that in your brew is wonderful--or even just a shovel of your own native soil will enrich your brew. Epsom salt and fish emulsion are also good additions if you really want to give your plants a feast.

Pen

Pennzer, how much of the yeast, molasses, Epsom salts and fish emulsion do you use? Do you ever use H2O2? Thanks.

Krnys, I make 15-gal batches. I start with 7-8 C. alf pellets (meal not available here), 1/2 C. molasses (or Karo syrup), and 1-2 Tbsp. yeast. On the third day I add about 1/2 C. Epsom Salts and 1/2 to 1 C. fish oil emulsion just before I apply it to plants. I just add the Epsom Salts about every 3rd application. For the 2nd batch from the sediment of the 1st batch, I add a couple more cups pellets and the same amounts of molasses and yeast as the 1st batch, but I do not add any more Epsom Salts or fish oil.

Is H2O2 hydrogen peroxide? No, haven't used that, but I'll read up on it. Is the theory that this will add oxygen to the mix? The stirring should accomplish this, but my mind is open, so please tell me what you know about it.

Pen

I had read on here in one of the threads that you should not use regular molasses but agriculteral molasses. Of course I haven't been able to find the latter. I wonder what the diifference is.

Oh look what i found__
Expert Exchange
This column will be a regular feature in Natural Horse. Your questions are invited.

Linsey McLean: Molasses and alfalfa:

Q: How can I avoid all that sugar from molasses in feed, and what is wrong with feeding alfalfa?

A: Many people do not know that there is really no sugar in agricultural molasses any more. It has all been extracted out to go for much bigger bucks per pound into the human market. Agricultural molasses is VERY bitter and used both as a "sticker" in grains to keep the light grains from settling out of the heavier ones and maintaining the consistency and uniformity of the mix, as well as a saliva stimulant to aid digestion. This kind of molasses even has to have sugar added back in to be sold as blackstrap molasses, the stuff WE consider bitter! So you don't have to worry about sugar. The term "sweet feed" was coined for feeds containing molasses over a century ago, when the refining techniques were not so good, and there actually WAS a sugar residue.

Regarding alfalfa, it contains at least five known compounds that interfere with the production of thyroid in the body. With environmental pollution already heavily targeting the thyroid, it doesn't need any more stress. It is one of those feedstuffs that we used to be able to use in past times better than we can now. It's a different world out there now.

http://www.naturalhorse.com/archive/volume3/Issue1/article_19.php

Pen, if you put H2O2 in the search box you will come up with a number of threads. This one has quite a lot of information. http://davesgarden.com/t/423312/H2O2

Also, are you using agricultural molasses or regular molasses?

No, you don't want agricultural molasses--you do want the sugar in order to feed the bacteria. Molasses is recommended because it is a complex sugar. Simpler forms of sugar--honey, sugar syrup (Karo) or white granulated sugar can be used, but the simpler the form of sugar, the fewer types of bacteria it will feed. Conversely, the more complex the sugar, the more types of bacteria it will feed.

I'm certainly no chemist, but I read an interesting discussion about this somewhere on the Net. I will paste it if I can find it again.

The aeration (stirring) and the sugar feed the aerobic bacteria in your brew, to the detriment of the anaerobic bacteria. You want a tea that is primarily aerobic. Certain anaerobes are beneficial, but most are pathogenic.

Both the sugar and the yeast assist fermentation of the alfalfa, which process yields triacontanol as a by-product. Triacontanol is a chemical (hormone) which is a byproduct of the fermentation of alfalfa. It is a well established fact that triacontanol increases the plant's ability to uptake nutrients from the soil and boosts its photosynthesis activities and, ergo, cellular division.

Yum! Make you wanna take a few swigs for yourself?

Pen

I would love to make the tea in large batches, but the idea of carrying two gallon milk jugs all over my yard sounds awful. Is there a container available to where the garden hose can be attached to the bottom and then used like that?

H2O2
If I understand what I have read about H2O2, it can be a double edged sword. Yes, it kills bad bacteria and dead organic matter and frees up oxygen for use by living plant roots, but it is nondiscerning: It also kills good bacteria and live organic matter. including plant roots. An overdose could actually harm living plant roots. I can appreciate how beneficial it can be if a plant is suffering from oxygen deficiency, but in the matter of adding to alfalfa tea, it seems it would be counterproductive. The whole purpose of treating with alfalfa is to add microbial colonies to the soil. If you need to treat your plants with H2O2, know that you are temporarily disturbing the micro environment in the process. I should think a follow-on treatment with alfalfa would be in good order to rebuild the microbial content.

Like all good things, I guess it comes down to a matter of balance. If a small amount of H2O2 is good, it does not follow that a large amount is even better.

Pen

Thanks, Pen. That sure makes sense. I guess I keep wanting to add H2O2 to everything because we have had soooo much rain this year. Sounds like I should apply an H2O2 solution separately to anything that seems to be waterlogged and follow your advice to use your concoction a little later. I don't think I want a swig though...no offense but it sounds awful! :^(~

Thanks Pennzer! Sounds like you have been making this for a while. Thanks for all your great tips. I am off to buy molasses and yeast! LOL

Pins, there probably is. Check chemical supply companies. (And let us know what you find.)

Pen

Thanks, y'all! I had a 50# bag of alfalfa pellets sitting under my potting bench, waiting for me to do SOMETHING with them ;o)

Thanks to Pennzer's recipe, I now have a 5-gallon tub o'brew (I reduced the ratio of pellets/molasses/yeast) loosely covered and cooking away in a shady spot.

Did I read the directions right: it should be ready in a day or two, just be sure to stir at least once a day?

Yes, Terry--stir at least once a day, more if you can. I keep my tub on the back patio and have a hose with a nozzle next to it. Every time I go out there I turn on the water, lift the lid and stick the jet nozzle down into it. This puts a lot of air into it. As warm as the weather is now, your brew will probably be ready in 24 hours, but you can let it ferment for up to 3 days if you like. If you wish to hold it more than 3 days, add more molasses and yeast and keep stirring/aerating to continue feeding those aerobes.

I expect to be hearing back from you in a few days to tell us the wondrous effects on your plants.

BTW: One of my neighbors is a retired nurseryman, and he had never heard of using alfalfa on plants. I did an experiment for him. I took 8 cuttings from his potato vines and stuck them in one of my flower beds. I drenched 4 of them with my brew and only watered the other 4. I used rooting hormone on all of them. That was about 2 weeks ago. I had him come look at them yesterday. All of the cuttings are putting out new leaves, but the four that got the brew have made more new leaves than the non-brew group, and they are easily twice as big--taller, bigger leaves, and stronger stems.

Love that brew.

Pen

OK, where can you get alfalfa pellets? I'd love to try this brew too!!

gg, I get mine from the local farmer's co-op. The only kind they have (or anyone around here) is the 1/4" pellet that is actually bagged as horse food. Some feed stores also carry the pellets in the form of rabbit food. Use the pure alfalfa (pellets, meal or hay) if you can find it, but the animal feed is OK, too. It might have some other stuff in it but usually nothing that would be harmful--just make sure there is no salt added. The pellets are easiest to handle.

I pay $6.35 for 50 lbs. at the co-op. That's why retail nursery people don't know or don't tell anyone about it. It's sooo cheap compared to the chemials they sell.

Let us know your results.

Pen

Found this on the Net..........................

http://homeharvest.com/waterfertilizerinjectors.htm

E-Z Flo Premium
Lawn & Garden Feeder

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Dilution rate is adjustable, so you can feed in minutes on the fast setting or for months on the slow setting


(every time you water). Mixing ratio is constant even with changes in the flow rate or water pressure, as low as 2.5 gallons per hour and 5 pounds per square inch (PSI) of pressure. You can see the fertilizer flow through the clear tubing on the cap as it's distributed through the watering system. Maximum tank operating pressure is 80 PSI.

No more mixing, measuring or burning! One pound of fertilizer applied the E-Z Flo way can do as much as 5 pounds applied in dry form. Because the fertilizer isn't diluted the 3/4 gallon tank will feed the average landscape for up to two months. The fertilizer mixing can be adjusted so 1 gallon of fertilizer is distributed in as little as 50 to as much as 2,000 gallons of water or any point in between. E-Z Gro applies fertilizer and other plant care products in liquid form, allowing the plants to absorb the nutrients immediately through the leaves and roots, so immediate results are seen.

Unit includes a hose bib connector (pictured) for garden hose or drip tube connection, and all the fittings and tubing for connection directly to a drip system.
Order #0015128
E-Z Flo Premium
Lawn & Garden
Feeder
54.95

I attended a MG Plant sale in Milwaukee this year. A fella there was selling a large plastic drum (at least 50 gal.). There was a brass hose-bib attatched as close to the bottom as possible before it curved under.

Drums like these are recycled from other uses. We see a lot of blue ones around here but his was a nice white one.

If you could elevate this on blocks or milk crates and have a step so you could reach inside to stir the brew

** Double ,double , Toil and trouble , ** my pretty !

The flow would be slow but for this app I think it would work.

rb, that looks like a good setup for concentrated fertilizer/insecticides but not for teas that you apply full strength. I can't think of a way to deliver tea except by bailing the tea and lugging those jugs around. Maybe one could make their brew in one of those chemical cubes that have spigots built in, and then put the cubes on a garden cart. As for me, I almost always have a brew cooking, and I use it up as far as it goes, then I take up where I left off with the next batch and so on--i.e., I do not make all the rounds in a single session.

Actually I just got another tub so I can now keep one batch going in front and one in back, so I don't have to go so far each time. I was emptying the garbage into the dumpster the other day, and I saw this big heavy duty plastic tub with lid on it in the dumpster. Thank goodness noone had put any garbage on top of it yet, so I rescued it to do duty as a tea tank. The guy across the alley has a pool, and the tub had contained an oxidizer he uses in his pool. Haven't measured its capacity yet, but I think it's about 30-gal. and has a great screw-on lid. I won't screw it on for making the tea--gotta keep air available--but it would be great for storing other things like alfalfa pellets you keep on hand. They can attract rodents and pets if not tightly stored. Or you could use if for storing finished compost, if you're fortunate enough to have a backlog of that.

So, if any of you or your neighbors have pools, you might want to recycle some of those tubs.

I've gotten way off-topic with this thread. Maybe we need a forum just for soil and fertilizers? There is much to be said on those subjects and much to be learned from others' experience. Terry, are you the one we should ask?

Pen

Well, I just answered my own question. There is a soil forum, and I haven't explored it yet. Should some of this thread be re-posted or referenced over there?

lol, you know, I never noticed this was a brugs thread - I searched for alfalfa tea and landed here, never gave much thought as to my whereabouts!!!

It would be great to get some conversations going in either soil and/or organics, so feel free to posta way over there.

Also, you can post your personal recipes and tips for teas in Garden Terms (I think there are already entries for alfalfa tea and others: http://davesgarden.com/search/terms.php?search_text=Tea+&Search.x=0&Search.y=0
Side note: Garden Terms is an excellent place to permanently store recipes, definitions, pictures (example: step-by-step processes, pictures of tools, teas, bugs, bug/disease damage, etc.) Then you can just refer back to them with a link when you need to direct someone to a particular gardening factoid.

On a personal note, my tea smelled a bit ummm, errr, well..."earthy" this morning. (Whew! And believe it or not, I spent my formative years on a farm, so I'm not all that put off by typical organic aromas ;o)

Anyway, do I use it full strength or dilute it? (I need to get it used up before Friday, as I'll be out of pocket for several days, then I can make up some more when I get back....)

Terry, use full strength around your plants. For general use between plants and in vacant beds, you can dilute 1:4.

If your tea is already smelling strong and is foamy on top, it is ready to go. If your temps are in the 90's it can really cook fast.

Didn't know about the gardening terms folder. Thanks for the info--I'm still learning my way around here. This is an awesome site--many features and great community spirit.

Pen