Can I multiply cannas by growing them in the GH over winter?

There are several cannas I have just too few of. Last spring, when I received three Pretoria rhizomes, the bed wasn't ready for them, so I put them in a big pot with good soil. When I was ready to plant them, in three or four weeks, they had doubled in size, and I was able to separate them and have six starts with at least two eyes each.

Could I have the same success by potting canna rhizomes and keeping them in the greenhouse this winter?

Is there any downside to doing this?

I potted some last year, my (favorites). Kept them in a well lit room, about 60+. They did well, planted whole plant outside, had lot of rhizomes to trade.

Great! That's what I was hoping to hear. Thanks, Hibiscus.

By the way, which are your favorites?

I kept a pretoria growing all last winter right in the house......

Hot Pink, China Doll, Miss Oklahoma, Pepto, all nice clear deep pinks, Christ's Light, green/white striped leaf. Aida-Peach.

I'm out of room in the house right now! I usually start mine inside at the end of January.

"eyes"

These are musafolias, of which I thought I had a lot more rhizomes than I do, and some Presidents (my mom's favorite) and I'm expecting a couple of Omega rhizomes soon, which I would love to multiply into a nice stand by spring. I might take up my light Pretorias, too, since I'd like to have more than I do.

I do have a lot of another Pretoria. This is a distinction that I can find no printed or online support for: New sprouts on my light Pretoria come out of the ground light green, the same color as mature leaves, but sprouts from the other Pretoria come up red and eventually turn light green. The adults and blooms look the same, except the one with red sprouts might grow a little taller, but that can be the result of placement, nutrients, etc.

Has anyone else noticed this? Is one of them another canna that I'm not familiar with?

Hibiscus, I'll have to look those up. My focus is species cannas, striped, variegated or dark colored foliage (anything besides green). There's a really nice aquatic canna (which can, of course, grow in soil) that is a lovely shade of pink. I'll try to remember to check on it for you.

Hibiscus -- OK, sit down before you look at these first three (oh yeah, you're probably already sitting down).

Pink Beauty http://www.cannas.net/prodpages/dwarf/pinkbeaut.htm

Dawn Pink http://www.cannas.net/prodpages/special/dawnpink.htm

Maudie Malcolm http://www.cannas.net/prodpages/special/maudiemalcolm.htm

The one I was thinking of was Longwood Pink, and wasn't so special when I looked at it again.

Here are some others that impressed me: Rosy (true seed; good for hybridizers), Pink Achievement, XS 4U (that's its name), Waldon Pond, Willingly 2U, and, of course, Pink Sunburst (a personal weakness because of the striped foliage). Unfortunately, some of these might be exclusive to the notorious Tyty Nursery.

I have 2 Pink Beauty(your pic) growing in pots, China Doll, Hot Pink are large bloom, small plant, same color pink, little yellow in center.

I have small rhizomes planted in with my brugs.

Hmmmm...Mystic sent me a bunch of rhizomes! If they are small ones, do they make small plants? Or just create fewer flowers? (As opposed to one that has many "eyes" on it.)
Anyone know?

Do not think you can go by looks of the rhizomes, just means you should have lots of cannas?

Thanks for the education on Canna's. We have a house around here that grows the huge ones in fire engine red and I always thought they were so oversized and way too bright, so I have since avoided anything regarding this plant. However, those dwarf pink ones are really just so pretty.

PlanterRik, You have ordered from Horns?

I really liked "Journey's End"
www.cannas.net/prodpages/special/journend.htm
I'm thinking of ordering as well.
(sorry can't figure out how to do the link)



This message was edited Monday, Dec 16th 9:55 AM

RootMD, No, never ordered from Horn. They have a small collection that focuses on the fluffy cannas -- a bias on my part. Since I'm interested in species cannas, my hands-down favorite is Karchesky. They have a huge and engrossing collection of every kind of canna. The prices per rhizome can be high, but the quality is also the highest. It's a good source of a wide range of canna seeds offered inexpensively -- and, since medium sized cannas can go from seed to bloom in four months, it seems like an advantageous route for me. If you grow cannas from seed, you will also have a source of canna seeds in the future, while many hybrid cannas will either not produce seeds or their seeds will not produce true.

Alyssum, if you like Journey's End, you might like Canna brasiliensis. It's a simpler flower, but has a nice passage from yellow to rose and lovely foliage: http://www.karcheskycanna.com/c-brasiliensis.htm

If anyone would like to explore cannas, here's a good collection of links: http://cannalily0.tripod.com/links.html
Some of the links are outdated. In those cases, you can search for the name of the grower to find the current site.

PlanterRik,You have schooled me once again,thanks,I sure have enjoyed this thread,I think I will try to go the seed route,I have had luck with seeds, but none of the beauties you have shown,Thanks,keep putting up the great links,has been very informative,Rtdr

This message was edited Wednesday, Dec 18th 12:03 PM

Can anyone tell me an easy way to nick canna seeds? I have tried lots of different ways, but all hard on your fingers and hands. Appreciate any help.

I'm gonna do some in a few minutes,I'll show you how I do it,Rik you might have to school me some more,I gotta haul plants in made mistake of going to GH for one little cactus,LOL

I use a Disc for a sander,so I don't knic,I'd cut my fingers off!120grit works for me.

Then get the little bugger between your fingers,an rub on disc till you see a little part of inside,then I soak.It's how I do my nails.LOL

I also do my nails that way...ha

Friend sent me lots of seeds, so had better get started. Thanks so much for the help!

If you have a good pair of hemostats,they keep you from getting down to the knuckle,lol

Way to go Root Dr. -- great demo.

On hard coated seeds I got tired of ruining whatever I have left of my nails (not to mention my patience), so I just use the tip of a sharp knife and just kind chip it. I've used this on Lupines which are pretty hard and MG's too. Just be careful!


This message was edited Monday, Dec 16th 5:45 PM

I've never understood how people nicked seeds with a knife. I tried for ages before I hit on my current method. I used to hold them with needle-nosed pliers and whittle or chip at them with my sharpest pocket knife. I think I destroyed as many seeds as I managed to properly nick.

Now, I use fingernail clippers for small seeds -- always making the tiniest nick on the end opposite the "eye" of the seed. For large (moonflower vine) or rounded (canna) seeds, I move up to giant toenail clippers. I find clippers give me much more control of the size and depth of the nick. If the seeds become slippery or otherwise resistant, I have my needle-nosed pliers ready for small seeds (MGs) and standard pliers for large ones.

I make an effort to be gentle with legumes, considering a good nick to be removing a flake of the casing.

Since I started using these tools, the personal injuries have dramatically decreased and germination has increased.

The most important thing I've picked up about seed-soaking is to keep a closer eye on them. "Overnight" is not the right length of time for many/most seeds. I have had some swell sufficiently in 2 hours or less (Japanese morning glories and Ipomoea tricolors like Heavenly Blue) and some have taken three weeks to crack their cases (Larkspur).

P.R. - great idea, I would have never thought of it!

This message was edited Wednesday, Dec 18th 8:28 AM

Since we are on the subject of cannas - can one of you experience growers let me know what type of soil, soil amendments and fertilizer you would recommend. Thanks!

Schooled again,Thanks PlanterRik,Just tried it,Wish I would have tried this many years ago,just never came to mind,Rtdr

I have another method of nicking the seeds which worked well for me. I have a small board, which has a few different sized holes in it, made by using various sized nails and a hammer. The seeds fit into one of the holes, to stabilize them, then I use a sharp knife to 'nick'/slice of a bit of the seedcoat. Quick and easy! John

Need advice. I really like cannas but I always have a pest problem with them. What do you use and how often. The leaves stay curled up and rot.

Sounds like wherever you plant them, may stay too wet? I dust the rhizomes of Iris and Canna with flower/rose dust before planting. Keeps bores,etc. out, so they aren't chewing roots.

I nick mine with a knife too.

PlanterRik - If you keep your cannas growing over the winter it needs to be as warm as possible but at the same time having enough ventilation to stop Botrytis growing on the leaves.

Allysum the best fertiliser by far is well rotted farm manure. I grow mine with a few handfulls per 14 inch pot. they also need as much water as possible. these will even grow partially underwater.

I understand that some cannas, but not all, qualify as marginals/semiaquatic, and those must be gradually accustomed to life under water (so I read, not being a pond person, yet).

Hummer -- Our Alabama red clay makes just about every hole into a container without drainage, which can lead to rotting. I try to combat it by working in anything that can improve drainage as deeply as possible: perlite, mini-nugget sized bark (provided it has lost the piney smell, which is some volatile compound; can't remember the name, but it's not good for most living things -- mammals, birds, flora -- which may contribute to its effectiveness as a weed-stopping mulch [end of digression]), organic composted bark (texture like flaky soil), sand, ‘soil conditioner’ (which is often mostly composted bark with peat and sand; so, again, check for piney aroma), etc. Nightcrawlers (large gray earthworms) also help with aeration because they come near the surface to feed, then go 18” or so down, leaving castings and aerating tunnels along the way. (I’m beginning a foray into vermiculture.) Redworms (“red wigglers,” in Alabamian) are good for composting/turning organic material, like most food scraps (not meat), into nutrient-rich castings, but they stay near the surface and don’t offer the same garden benefits as nightcrawlers.

Fungi are another problem here from fall to mid-spring; perhaps temperatures under 70F give them an advantage. When trying to root cuttings in the winter (inside, between 68 and 72F), mold and fungus almost always overtake cuttings unless I use a fungicide. I expect reduced sunlight contributes to the problem.

Mark -- Thank you for cluing me in regarding Botrytis. I’ll read up on it. Ventilation in the greenhouse is good – I have a box fan always running to bring in fresh air and a vent always open. With my current heating system, the temperature stays at 68F. Is that sufficient for indoor canna growing? I am looking for a vented, natural-gas heat-blower (that I can afford) to be in place before the colder weather comes. That should allow me to keep it at 72F -- I don’t think I can convince my wallet to support higher temps. [I’m also fervently looking for bottom-heat mats, if anyone has any to sell or trade!]

Here is what Alice Harris and Dave Karchesky (my chosen canna mentors) write about preparing soil for cannas: “The ground should have lots of organic materials worked into it, compost, composted manure, leaves, grass clippings and kitchen garbage (peelings), egg shells, coffee grounds (but no processed foods like meats, fats or anything of that nature). In other words, if it is organic and will decompose, use it.” Here is a link to their page of growing tips: http://www.karcheskycanna.com/growingtips.htm

Such soil amendments are also good bait to attract earthworms to your canna bed.

RootMD – I’m glad you find some of my posts useful. I tend to hold forth/blather (see preceding six paragraphs), but I’m only an amateur gardener. I hope “schooling” is a good word in your book.

All – Is calling me “PRik” your way of telling me something?

LOL! Didn't use after first time I saw what it looked like in a post.No I'm sittin here lookin an learnin(schooled)lol,day you started this thread I spilled a box of Bengals while hooking up lights,Figgered it was easier to plant em then get em back in box,lol so I am in here but under lights,Learning tons!DW didn't know why I'd buy 4dz crawlers when we went to lake,then toss most on compost pile when we got home!years ago I gave a kneehigh salmon canna away and now I need to fill the void it left.I have good luck with cannas so now I need to get some keepers,So don't mind me,I want to get REAL keepers,PLriK you have put up some amazing links! Thanks to all who asked the Questions I had, but didn't post!

Thanks so much PlanterRik, this has been a real "good" learning experience! Can't wait until next year to get them growing outside. Have lots of named varieties. My second year of growing canna.
Gloria

Thanks P.R. - I edited my post up top -- LOL - was completely unintentional! This thread has been helpful and inspiring. I ordered a bunch of Canna's from Horns and am going ot alternate them in a long spread of Siberian Irises to give some nice fall color.

I am not sure why they like it so much here . . . but most of my property is filled with nightcrawlers and other worms -- and they sure are welcome.

you must remember that green kitchen waste, leaves and grass must be composted before putting then into a pot or ground with a plant otherwise they will burn the roots as thet breakdown.

I would be more worried about light levels to go with your heat. I dont know where Birmingham is other than our one. how high is the sun at this time of year? ours doesnt reach more than about 10.30 if you make the horizon 9am and 3pm if you know what I mean