Good News!

GRIN has just updated it's files on Epipremnum pinnatum and Epipremnum aureum, and so has the PlantFiles !

Here is Epipremnum pinnatum

http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/192743/

http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/taxon.pl?312725

Here is Epipremnum aureum

http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/51451/

http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/taxon.pl?315461

Thanks for your patience in addressing this matter.

Much thanks to Steve (ExoticRainforest) for his efforts to make this update happen!

Aloha, Dave

Here is Epipremnum pinnatum, Tonga Vine.

Here is Epipremnum aureum, Golden Pothos.

What's the natural distribution of Epipremnum pinnatum? I've seen identical looking plants in Queensland, they're quite common there and look really good draping rainforest trees.

On the subject of corrections, when's the incorrect scaevola sericea on Plantfiles going to be changed to the correct Scaevola taccada that I requested about a year ago? DG does seem slow in correcting errors.

You are very observant TropicBreeze. According to the Royal Botanic Garden Kew the native range is tropical and subtropical Asia into the Pacific islands and includes the north central regions of Australia. Chances are good it has been imported into your area as well.

I possible please post more photos!

Steve



This message was edited Jul 2, 2010 9:01 PM

Hi Tropicbreeze! I went to check it out and it had already been corrected: http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/go/59171/

Another Epipremnum pinnatum

Epipremnum aureum

Great photos Dave! When I look at your adult and mid-adult specimen photos I always wonder if growers realize the second and third photos are the same tiny plant my of us grow on our kitchen counter and just call it "Pothos"? The same one we buy in WalMart.

Steve

Watch out!

Here's the aggressive invasive plant that Epipremnum aureum becomes in Hawai'i.
It is overwhelming a coastal forest in the below photo.

It easily climbs to the canopy of most trees, and eventually brings them to the ground!

Amazing! I had no idea those little plants turned into such monsters. Beautiful monsters. Glad to find this thread.

Close-up of the pretty looking "devil's ivy"!

metro, is that a pic you took? Is it considered a pest there? If so how do you deal with it?

Yes, the plant is too common around here. The photos are from various places on Windward Hawai'i Island.
I don't have to control it, as I have never planted it on my farm.

Certainly don't want to interrupt your great thread and photos Dave but this may help growers to envision the varied growth of the species Epipremnum aureum, commonly called Pothos.

The leaves in this photo range from 4 inches to 2.5 feet and everyone is growing on the same plant. As it climbs the trees it morphs into leaf blades with totally different shapes than most of us ever see. Just like a child "morphs" as it grows from a baby to an adult and into old age our bodies change. Aroids do the same.

The photo to the lower left is similar in size to the blades you are showing but the elongated blades in the center are on the same plant and are substantially larger.

If you ever get the chance I'd love to see photos of the blades at the very top of your trees!

Steve


This message was edited Jul 2, 2010 11:02 PM

What makes them change? Age? Conditions? I'm wondering if one could get them to make the big leaves in their house.

Mine get really big leaves in the tree tops. Now it's the dry season and windy so some of the large leaves are falling. They're nearly the size of pillow cases. The runners that hang down from the trees and those on the ground have very small leaves.

Tropic, you are fortunate you can see this happening naturally.

The process is known as ontogeny. That big word simply means the natural aging of any living organism.

As a child ages, it changes. As any animal ages, it changes, it is just a natural process. There are actually two processes that go on with plants, the first being natural ontogeny and the second being natural variation within species. Since I would eat up a ton of space here trying to explain it, and I know for certain many people would not be interested, I'd like to just give you a link:

http://www.exoticrainforest.com/Natural%20variation%20within%20aroid%20and%20%20plant%20species.html

As you will see on the page many aroids can take on totally different "faces" as they age and the leaves of a species do not always look alike. When we last updated this article some months ago I used one of Dave's photos above to illustrate this point by comparing the juvenile form most of us grow of Epipremnum pinnatum to the adult leaf he shows. Sometimes they are so radically different most of us would not recognize them as the same species.

I had a of of help writing that page and it has been reviewed by scientists that know far more than I do. You'll find lots of photos and we do our best to keep it simple. If I loose you somewhere I'll be glad to try to answer the questions but all of this is quite simple.

We grow, we age and eventually we vanish as an individual. Plants do the same thing.

Steve



This message was edited Jul 3, 2010 8:09 AM

This message was edited Jul 3, 2010 8:14 AM

Great news and work.

Killdawabbit, yes, by giving the vine something to climb such as a totem/etc. you can achieve larger leaves even when growing as a houseplant.

Note: the small leaf laying to the right is from one in a hanging basket.

Thanks, Rachel. I wonder if it would climb my monstera without damaging it. Or do you suppose it would attach itself to the wall like the monstera did?

This message was edited Jul 3, 2010 1:07 PM

Alistair, I'd assumed that they'd somehow meant it to be north central on the east coast of Queensland, but it does look a bit misleading on the face of it. Do you have any idea of this similar (although still a bit different) looking one, larger leaves, growing just west of Kokoda in the lower foothills of the Owen Standley Ranges?

I'm curious. If one were to take and root a cutting of a mature one would it keep producing the adult leaves or start putting out juvenile leaves?

That does look like Epipremnum pinnatum.

The shoots that grow out of the cutting will be smaller and juvenile-like.

To get mature leaves you need a mature plant.

Gotcha. Not like Hedera then, huh?

Hello there Alistair! I took that info from the map on CATE Araceae when you pull up the species. Thanks for the correction. I knew you were around but this is the first time I've encountered your posts, please keep us all in line!

Steve

Hey Steve! Are you suggesting that we need that we need some type of guidance?

Well, I'm not looking for any Generals to get involved but if Alistair speaks I listen! I have been asking him aroid questions for several years.

Steve

Killdawabbit, the answer would depend on how you grow the adult cutting. If you grow it in the same manner and light conditions in which it has already been growing the chances are good. However, I have been given adult cuttings of quite a number of aroids and if I place them in a lower light condition or don't give them a tall totem to climb the leaves often become deciduous and drop then revert back to a more juvenile form. Four years ago I was given a cutting of Monstera adansonii with leaves nearing 3 feet but when I hung it on a south wall where the light was not as strong with some shade everyone of the big leaves dropped. The plant then went totally juvenile and is only now again beginning to produce big leaves since we hung it high from the ceiling where the light is much brighter. I would doubt an adult leaf form would remain adult if brought into a home but it just might happen.

I was given some very adult cuttings of some very large Philodendron species so we hung all of them from the ceiling of our atrium in bright light with a four foot totem to climb and after a year they are still growing new adult leaves. The problem now is all of them have grown as high on the totem as possible and are now dropping vines that are again reverting.

If you had the chance to read the link I gave earlier you know that aroids commonly climb in order to reach brighter light. As they climb, they morph into the adult form. It is all just Mother Nature's way and I find it fascinating to watch.

Steve

This message was edited Jul 3, 2010 8:00 PM

Thanks, Steve. I love finding out this stuff. What I wouldn't give for a 1 acre conservatory. Never gonna happen for this poor stiff.

I had guests from Indiana this week that drove down to see what Janice and I have built. They plan to build one 5 times the size of our tropical atrium with a 30 foot ceiling! I asked if they would consider just adopting me and build it in my yard.

Steve

LOL...I suppose the greatest expense would be heating in the winter?

Hi killdawabbit. Steve is very right about adding very bright light as well. What most of us buy at the big box store's such as Epipremnum plants are often tagged "low" light plants which in all reality do alot better when given a "bright light" environment. If you want to use your Monstera to support the vine then by all means go ahead. You can alway's control the vine if it starts attaching itself to structures by cutting it back and starting new plants with the cuttings if you would like.


Being that yours and mine are only houseplants they never will be a problem and especially will never be out of control like some of the pictures Dave showed from Hawai'i in which they are a weed there. You can "somewhat" relate their weed to some of our Hedera plants which does consume large trees and take over.

By the way, nice Monstera.

Thanks, I may give it a try.

I can give you near adult cuttings of Epipremnum aureum but not Epipremnum pinnatum. I can easily cut vines with leaves approaching 1 foot, perhaps larger. Just drop me a private note.

Steve

I can vouch for that. Steve had cutting's of Epipremnum aureum laying on the ground that I walked upon while visiting his Atrium. I think they were going to his compost pile if I remember correctly. Those leaves were very large!

I find the only way to kill off Pothos is to freeze it. Throw it anywhere and it just keeps growing. Here's some of the leaves that have been falling off mine laying beside a runner, and a spade for comparison. The leaves are 75 centimetres (just under 2.5 feet) long. Leaves on the runner are the usual juvenile size.

Alistair, how interesting you mention Rhaphidophora korthalsii! I have an email from a grower in Thailand this morning trying to find a specimen but don't have a clue how to tell him where to find it. Do you or anyone in that part of the world know how we can assist him?

Tropic, your leaves look exactly like the ones at the very top of my plant. If you can post photos of those blades alive I would like to see more.

Thanks!

Steve

Thanks Alistair. I'd suspected it was different but when you gave the range of Epipremnum pinnatum as only up to Torres Strait that confirmed it. Never occured to me it might have been a Rhaphidophora though.

A photo with people to give a better size perspective.