Please share your experience, as I recalled that someone has mentioned that Porterweed can be used as substitute meal for this types of cats. Thanks in advance for your input, this valuable info. can help other butterfly-gardener(s).
This pix shows a couple Monarch cats while they're feeding on wild milkweed.
I'd like to know that information as well so I'll sit and lurk.
I have both milkweed and porterweed and have never seen monarchs on the porterweed except to drink nectar.
are you asking if the caterpillar would eat the porterweed as a host plant? If so, the answer would be no.
Good morning to both. RP. I remembered one of us -- DGer -- has shared that Porterweed was a hostplant substitute for Milkweed. But, I'm testing my short-term memory bank here to be sure. lol.
I'm conducting an experiment; I've sheltered 5 Monarch cats and have been keeping them happy with the milkweed feed. This morning I added a stem of Porterweed into the mix. I'll report back and see if the little cats. will pay the new addition into their breakfast menu this am.
Will report back this evening.
I've asked a friend to drop in and help out.
I'm far from being any authority on butterfly populations, but until I actually got an Asclepias plant, I never had Monarch cats. The adults would come by now and then and feed on other flowers nectar, but I never saw any larvae or any pupae.
Maybe I missed something in the original post, but are you asking this question because Asclepias won't grow where you are, or because you can't find the plants or seeds for them ?
My Asclepias plants are LOADED with seeds at the moment. If any of you want seeds, let me know and I can send them to you.
It is amazing though, how once you do get one of these plants, the butterflies will find them... as well as how the larvae will strip the plant of it's foliage in nothing flat.
Of added interest, I never get those bright yellow aphids on anything else but the Asclepias. On day the plant will be infested with them and the following day they're nowhere to be found. I assume the Monarch cats eat the aphids as well...???
Thanks, JD.
JD, thank you for your visit as well as your offer for the 'Milkweed's seeds'. I raised the question above because the need arises for another gardener friend who's in search of extra Milkweeds in the garden for her caterpillars -- apparently a newbie who's trying to save her Monarch cats. from the harsh environment out there...
I'm fortunate to have plenty of the Mexican Milkweed (also known as tropical milkweed ?), that's proven to be hardy in my zone.
This early morning, I initiated an experiment with introducing my Monarch cats. a branch cutting of blue Porterweed among other 2 cuttings of Milkweed (Asclepias). I just now returned and checked on them. One of my 5 cats has proceeded to form its initial stage of pupation, while the other 4 are busily munching on the Asclepias and have yet shown interest on the Porterweed -- that is up onto this point. For the Ascepias is dwindling down, I'll see if they will turn to the Porterweed when they get hungry?
Here are the Monarch Cats. huddling on the last bit of Asclepias cutting -- nub and all, and the Porterweed is untouched. More info. will be available this afternoon.
Forgive the 'cloudiness' appearance of the pix, it was taken over the mesh-like barrier.
Guess what folks? One of the 4 caterpillars is offcicially on the Porterweed! Yes, I refrained from adding fresh Milkweed cuttings into the cage at lunch time. Yes, these little ones are ready for lunch as well.
So far, the explorer caterpillar got onto the Porterweed and promptly got off of it. Phooeyyy! They returned to the 'snubs' on the Asclepias stalks and resumed munching and left the Porterweed alone.
Oh well...you tried !
I never thought they would eat porterweed; it's not even close to being in the same family as milkweed. That being said, there are many kinds of milkweed so try growing different kinds and try to find ones that are native to the area. I think it helps if you have plants that are on the same schedule as the butterflies. I also like to keep a few in pots on the patio and rotate them out as needed.
Melanie
Tried I've. So that's how things work. lol. Thank you, Mel. This particular gardener was in search of Milkweeds, she lives in Arkansas. I thought I recalled something from last year, or year before last info. But I may have dreamed it up. Hmmm.
I'm glad that I've a ton of MW in the garden for these munching piggies which are so much fun to watch. This is my first time trying to raise Monarch indoor. I'm keeping my fingers crossed just long enough, then I found myself having to cut more MW for them. lol
They can be piggies!
By the end of the evening, I've one cat. hung up side down in a J position, then it fell off the canope of the cage. I gently helped it back up with a safety pin. This morning I saw a second one pupated. Then the 3rd wanderer finally formed its up- side- down J.
Last year I had numerous pupae around my garden that never developed...I think the poor things froze. They turned black after about 2 weeks.
I always feel really bad when I'm clipping something and find a pupae attached to the clipping. The undersides of window sills seems to be a favored place for them to hang.
It is amazing though, how FAST those larvae grow.
Jasper...Is it Monarchs that you had? If so, they do turn black about 11 days after going into the "J" before emerging. Did they remain black more than a day or two?
On finding the clipping, just stick them on another plant or stick in the ground and they will be fine. The ones I hate to find or unknow caterpillars in a pile that are mixed clippings. I have no clue what it was eating to return it or feed it.
Yes, for sure they were monarchs. They turned black and stayed that way for weeks on end, long past the time they should have emerged. The blackness started right when we got hit with a cold snap...which is what makes me think they froze.
A few did emerge and had deformed wings and died within a few hours. Some looked like they were having difficulty emerging from the pupae and died in the process, like they were stuck.
Then I thought some other insect predator may have attacked the pupae and killed them. It was really depressing to see so many of them die like that. Maybe there's a wasp of some sort that attcks the pupae ???
I hardly ever use chemicals, so I know it wasn't something I contributed to and if and when I use sprays, I'm extremely careful not to get near the Asclepias.
Right now there are LOADS of larvae in all sizes, so I hope the same thing doesn't happen again !
Also, yes, I do "relocate" the larvae back to the garden when I find them in clippings :)
Oh, yes they were goners then. I had seven Monarchs earlier last month and four of the seven did that. Turned dark and then either emerged crumpled and dry or didn't come out at all. Someone suggested it might be the OE that they get.
http://www.mymonarchguide.com/2007/11/oe-on-caterpillars.html
Wow ! That's really a GREAT link, Sheila. Thanks so much for posting that. That has to be what the issue was with mine. The symptoms seem identical. Amazing the things you can learn, huh ?
Yes anything you want to know is out there somewhere on the WWW!!
WWW = Wild Wild West? LOL, just kidding. I missed that show on T.V. a long long time ago. All kidding aside, thank you Sheila for the link. Something is going on with my caterpillars! 3 went to find a place to pupate. All three are turning dull and black, and appear dehydrated! I'm not very happy!
Look at them through a magnifiying glass and see if it looks like the OE in the picture. After they finish pupating, you may want to quarantine them until after they emerge and you check them out.
Sheila, It's heart wrenching to watch these cats struggle. What's more is that they don't have a good chance surviving outdoor. I walked out the garden and checked on the many various instars Monarch that I've noticed all over the garden. Two of them were apparently dead and the probable predator Assassin bug was near by. Not to mention others such as birds, spiders, wasps and the chain goes on and on ...
I've seen your posts on techniques of successfully raising cats. Could you please direct me back to those threads? I'd appreciate that. Thank you.
Hi folks,
I looked for alternate host plants for Monarchs & this is what I found. I've never tried this. I'm just passing on the info. I found some other links but they were for overseas.
http://www.monarch.org.nz/monarch/monarchs/pumpkin/
http://tinyurl.com/lyh6yy The first paragraph of this excerpt is interesting- r/t how we plant out our MW patches
cels.uri.edu/pls/biocontrol/docs/pp%20slide.ppt Doubt this will be much help in the short run but here it is
Maggie
Thanks for the links Maggie, may give that a try around Oct with some last instar Monarchs.
Lily....I have a short explaination in my diary, just click on my ID and go to view it. I will look for the other thread too.
I found something on a butterfly website last night that said Tachinid flies will parasitize Monarch pupae. The pupae will blacken in one specific area, (not the entire pupae) at first. Evidently, as the pupae dies the entire thing goes black.
Yes, as I recalled a Sphinx Moth's caterpillar was infected by the Tachinid flies. What terrible thing!!! Thanks JD for sharing the info.
Sheila,
SO glad I had something to offer. I always LOVE your posts re: cages, raising B-Flies.
Maggie
We all have something to learn from, and to share with others on DG.
Jasper..... The Tachinid Fly unfortunately are sold to farmers to protect their crops, but they multiply and then attack our caterpillars in our yards. The Monarch isn't the only butterfly they parasitize. But since it only takes 10 days for a Monarch pupa to emerge as a butterfly and the green shows the damage so well; they are a good example.
This was one I had last year I think. The poor cat ate and ate and all the time the larvae of the fly was inside destroying the part of it that is used to form the butterfly. Then when the caterpillar made the chrysalis and can't continue the transformation; the larvae of the fly forms it's pupa and will emerge to infect more cats.
Yes ....the brown things are the pupa that came out of the chrysalis.
