My beloved damaged persimmon tree (will green fruit ripen?)

Howdy, Folks...

I was happily picking okra and tomatoes today, enjoying the nice wind, and at some point heard a cracking noise. An hour later I discovered the source, my treasured Sheng persimmon tree had two major branches fall off, one to each side of the tree. Shucks!

If any of ya'll are familiar with this Oriental variety you might know it is not as astringent as the American persimmons and doesn't rely on a hard frost to sweeten it up. However, I'm hoping someone will know from experience if it is worth picking all the green persimmons in the hope they will ripen.

I've Googled a bit and some sites say yes, others say no.

Question: Does anyone know, or have any input on whether these green persimmons will ripen off the tree? The tree is really loaded this year.

Much obliged!
Shoe (Who has visions of persimmon cookies, persimmon puddin', persimmon pie, in his head)

And a pic of the other side of the tree.

What a loss of good fruit, eh?

Shoe

Shoe, You forgot persimmon beer. seriously I doubt that they will ripen, because i would guess they are more than a month from maturity. Two weeks from maturity, yes but not a month or more.

Aw Shoe, what a shame.

If the fallen branches are not completely broken from the trunk, and they don't look like they are, I would leave it all lay as it is. I do think they will ripen.

If they are broken completely off, I doubt it but I would pull the branches away somewhere with your tractor and still leave them lay. They just might, you never know.

I'm so sorry.

Hmmm...persimmon beer. Hah!

I was hoping they were big enough, F-dill, but it's true, these normally don't ripen till Halloween. (The look like little orange pumpkins tied in the tree at that time.)

Well, I guess my chickens might like a few. Besides, I've never seen a chicken with their beaks all puckered up, might be entertaining!

Thanks!
Shoe

We posted at the same time, Vic...

No, the branches aren't completely severed but probably enough that they might not get much food/energy passing to them. Course now, I know when I want some firewood I've often wished I'd have cut some downed trees from their roots cus they were too wet to burn, even after months of being downed.

You might have a point, storing the whole branches; maybe the persimmons will ripen like when I pull up tomato plants with green tomatoes on them.

Bummer, eh? Oh well, it could've been worse. And now we are in a severe T-storm warning so guess I'll wait and see if the rest comes down before the night is over.

Happy Gardening!
Shoe

I guess my thoughts run in the" it can't hurt to try "
I am heartsick for you at the sight of you tree.. I get very attached to mine..

Thanks, KJo, yeh..that tree was a keeper, got that for my DW one year for Christmas, and it produced a bumper crop after the 3rd year. Quite a good producer, too.

There are several more branches that are bearing so hopefully we'll still get a harvest.

Will keep ya'll posted on the outcome.

Shoe

Sorry to se the loss, Shoe. My (native) persimmins were so loaded last year that they broke many of their branches. They look pathetic, but are showing reasonable fruit. Everything produced at high rate last year, I think they all thought the drought was going to kill them off :(.

I sure hope they ripen for you. Hmmm. Think I'l lwander off to see if there's anything one can do with green persimmons...

Cool! If you any green persimmon recipes please holler.

I guess I'll have to lop off those broken branches this week, at some point the grass and weeds will grow up thru them and I'll have a mess. And I think the August sun will scorch the fruit. Maybe I should hoist the branches, with fruit intact, onto the branches of another tree in the semi-shade or something, hoping the fruit will hang on till October!

Oh well....

We had a bit of rain last night, my veggie garden is still producing a bit, and 3 newly-sown rows of field peas have declared. Not bad, I'd say!

Happy Gardening!

Shoe

Is there any way you could prop them up where they lay and put a 2 x 4 or a 2 x 6 under them? Enough that you could mow under them?

Good idea, Vic. But it seems this tree has a mind of its own. Today I found lots of the persimmons had fallen from the broken branches, just laying on the ground. I guess the shock of it all caused them to turn loose or something. Some feel soft, some are seeming to turn lighter colored, yellow-ish even. If I get brave I'll bite into one and see if I pucker up!

Shoe

Hmmm....one year later and I could'a sworn I had posted last years fruit outcome. It turned out that many of them actually ripened; apparently there was enough attachment of the broken limbs to keep the leaves on the tree and also to provide moisture to the fruit. I can't remember how many we got but quite a few.

And now, this year, I'm still getting some. I ended up trimming off some of the branches that were dried up, saved some of the other branches that were heavily leaning down but still growing. I had ideas of rooting some of the new growth earlier this year but never go around to it. A month or so ago I was actually thinking of taking some growth buds and try grafting them onto the root stock. (You can see all the tall straight-up branches growing, those are root stock branches.)

As of this week I've picked about 15 RIPE 'simmons though, with many more to come!

I think I'll end up trimming up the tree after this harvest though, I don't care to have the limbs down on the ground like this all summer again.

Shoe (who will make persimmon cookies this week!)

Next spring, when the fruit is still small, you might consider thinning down to 1 persimmon per node. This will help reduce the weight on the thin branches and as a bonus the fruit that remains will grow larger.

When our children were young, I made persimmon cookies. Later, I bought a dehydrator. Dried persimmon slices are fantastic. The flavors and sugars are concentrated. I can hardly wait until my Fuyu tree is large enough to dehydrate some provided the wasps and squirrels leave some for me..

This message was edited Oct 27, 2010 7:35 PM

Thanks, bettydee. I've thought of tying up one of the bigger side branches hope to create a new "trunk". Heck, I've even thought of putting up a horizontal trellis and making this poor broken tree into an espalier, too. Unfortunately I may be building a shadehouse structure where the tree is, hence the idea of bud grafting and starting several new trees.

I have a dehydrator! I should try drying some, those dried persimmons sound delish.

Someone recently asked if I had a recipe for persimmon candy, all I have is cookie and pudding recipes. Would anyone happen to have a recipe for candy using persimmons?

Shoe

Hope this isn't interrupting too much - I have a Fuyu grafted onto a hardy root stock for my 6b zone. I swear that I have had this in the ground for at least 5 years and I have yet to get a single flower. The tree is healthy and very pretty as it is not it full sun it is staying shrubby - but am I ever going to get fruit?

How much full sun does you Fuyu get? Ideally, the tree should get full sun all day long. How tall is your "shrub"? Do you fertilize it?

Normally, a Fuyu persimmon tree, which had a 1/2" - 1" trunk when planted, is growing in full sun and fertilized regularly, starts to produce a few fruits by its second or third spring.

Your Fuyu may be getting too much root competition for available nutrients and coming out the loser. It is possible that it doesn't get enough sunlight and thus doesn't have the energy resources to produce flowers and fruit. You are pushing the zone a bit. Since the chill hour requirement is very low — 100 hours — It's possible that it is breaking dormancy too soon and freezes damage or kill the flowers. This spring look for flowers,
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3019/2475681474_eab7341f74.jpg?v=0
http://www.crfg.org/pubs/ff/persimmon.html
Here it persimmon trees don't bloom until May making them very reliable fruit producers. Is it possible for you to provide more sunlight or move it to a sunnier southern location?




This message was edited Oct 29, 2010 3:23 PM

Thanks for the info. I've seen Fuyus growing as an under story tree and I was hoping it would do that for me. I never thought about it being under the roots of a huge oak tree. (I raised the bed level so it is above the oak roots - or so I thought.) I will have to see if I can figure out somewhere else to put it. (My yard is tiny!) I do fertilize it with Gardens Alive fruit tree fertilizer and mulch with whatever I get my hands on that will break down. It truly looks beautiful - just no flowers. As to the zone - "we" got upgraded to zone 7 recently and my tea camilla (which is also pushing the zone) nearby is doing beautifully as long as I give it a wind break in the winter. The root stock the Fuyu was grafted on to is supposed to be hardy enough for zone 6 - I just don't remember what it is.

Do you happen to know how big it will get?

According to that CRFG link I sent you, unpruned it can grow to be 25' x 25', but I had 2 Fuyu trees that were 15 years old by the time we sold our house and moved to Texas. With some spring pruning done every year, they were still under 8' x 8' when we moved. They are slow growers.

Japanese persimmons are usually grafted to D. kaki seedlings, D. lotus or D.virginiana. True Fuyu persimmon (Jiro is often sold as a Fuyu.) trees can't be grafted onto D. lotus as the graft is rejected. I had the real thing back in California, but I can't find Fuyu grafted on to D. kaki anymore. My "Fuyu" here in Texas is probably a Jiro because it is grafted onto D.lotus which tends to sucker from shallow roots. Locally sold "Fuyu"s are grafted onto D. virginiana