A major question on chichen disease

Hi,
We have a chicken that I thought maybe had Marek's disease. Now I'm not so sure as so what it had. Has anyone known a chicken to survive Marek's disease?
Both of it's feet were paralized. It is a rooster, and it's top notch didn't grow. It looked more like a hen. It looked like its foot was swollen at the joint were the paralysis started on it. It ended up losing both of it's feet, and now has growen it's top notch and does look like a rooster. And even without feet, he gets around like you wouldn't believe. Wing power!
We did lose one beautiful Araucana roo to the the same thing, another Araucana hen had the same problems with the feet being paralized and starting to fall off. My boyfriend felt sorry for her when he saw the foot was falling off and put her out of her misery. :( The one that we still have, well his feet feel off when my boyfriend didn't know about it. And since he is doing so much better, he is still living.
None of these chickens were vaccinated, as we are pretty new to rasing chickens and didn't know about it.
Any ideas anyone?
Meet Footless as we call him.

It doesn't sound like Marek's to me. They do sometimes recover from mild Marek's--but I have never heard of a foot swelling or falling off. When Marek's affects a nerve it leads to paralysis and gradual debilitation. It can affect other organs and cause sudden death--but your symptoms are really different.

It sounds somewhat familiar, though--off-hand like a bacterial infection--but there may be something else that could cause it.

Help!

that is not a normal thing to just happen there is a cause behind it. i agree doesn't sound like merek's to me either. from what u described and seeing the pic of him i'd say it was from severe frostbite that happened awhile ago and this is the last of the healing process u r seeing now.
hope that helps,
silkie

Boy this is interesting!! If this were an isolated case I to woud thing frostbite. but mentioned that there were others with this problem and that makes me wonder or question the frostbite thing. I don't really have the answer but thanks for showing and sharing. I'm going to search some of my sources as this is interesting. Haystack

Hmmmmmmm, I'll have to run the frostbite idea past my boyfriend. Thanks silkie.
And thanks Haystack for doing some searching because we are lost as to what it might be. I was at the point of not wanting to raise out own chicks anymore. I hate to see them go through this.
I have a question though on the frostbite idea.
Why did the comb on footless not grow at all during that time then? I couldn't tell if he was a rooster or a hen, until he lost his feet. It was after that that his comb and waddles both started to grow and he started crowing. And he showed no signs of frost bite on his waddles or comb.
The Araucana Rooster that we lost was the same age and had full waddles and comb.
We have 14 hens and 3 roosters at present time and they are divided into 2 coops. The younger ones are in one and the older ones are in the other one. All of them that had the problem where in the youngsters coop.
This is one of our young Araucana hens that is in the same coop and is the same age. She is a very friendly little girl and lays the most interesting color of eggs, not a light green, but more headed towards and olive green. Sorry if the picture is a little dark, but they were in the shade when i took them :)

This is a description of some of the worst forms of bumble foot--which would explain the swollen hocks:

http://www.thepoultrysite.com/diseaseinfo/143/staphylococcosis-staphylococcal-arthritis-bumble-foot

The scaly leg mites will make toes fall off! EEEE!

http://ohioline.osu.edu/vme-fact/0019.html

Scroll to the bottom

In all my years in the chicken world i have never seen this and i have seen rotten combs but never rotten feet.

I know, and i felt so bad for him. His feet just became paralized. And he had a hard time getting around with them when he still had them. They got in the way for him. Now he uses his wings alot, and he seems to be doing just fine, he has adjusted.
I'm glad I became a subscriber, because I really wanted to ask if anyone had ever seen anything like this.
I'll try to get some better pictures the next time I go to my boyfriends. So I should be able to post them in about 2 weeks.
Thank you all for your help in trying to figure out what it is.

I would think if it were frostbite, he would not have a comb!

Hi Kassy!! It is a pleasure having you here on the forum. I also am glad you joined. I called and spoke with a friend who works for Backyard Poultry Mag and he also refered to a strong possibility of Bumble foot. It was probably an infection that set in before you owned the birds. I'm glad you didn't give up on them and you sound like a very good and compasionate lady who cares for her flock. Keep up the good work and let us hear from you more often. Best wishes Haystack


Great job Catscan, What would we do without you??? Your such an asset to this forum. Hay

if u look at his comb in the pics they look frostbite he does not have the normal length and tips on them plus the little black specks on the comb most of it looks pretty healed up.

i have had seramas and cochins get it and they still have combs just the tips r messed up and end up more rounded looking. i have a friend who also has roos with it but a little worse which is weird they r all in the same yard and u'd swear they were dubbed when chicks. they have no starts of tips at all it looks like a smooth flat single comb that sticks up about 1/4 to 1/2" yet the majority of both flocks have never had it at all. i've only had 1 hen with that severe of frostbite she sat in a waterer in 5 degree weather and i ended up haveing to amputate both feet and part of her leg. it is possible for one or a few to get it depending on conditions and how much moisture is in the air. weather they fully loose the wattles and combs or not would depend on the severity of it and other factors.

Wouldn't the damage from frostbite also allow bacteria in?

Wow.. you know I'm in zone 9.. I don't even know what zone 4 would be really like! I don't know snow, or frozen ground.. or frostbite.. no wonder it's like the last thing I would think of.. I'm sorry.

Also.. forgive my rudeness Kassy.. Welcome to the Forum! I'm ZZ the class clown.. I love to help out..(sometimes a little too much maby) my experience with poultry is not nearly as much as horses.. I'm here and am glad you are too.

Haystack i agree with what you said Bumble foot if left untreated could turn into something like us getting Gangrene.
This severe infection could worsen and could cause the feet to literally rot away.

silkie, Footless is in with another rooster. The other rooster does tend to pick on him. Not when I'm around he doesn't though! The other rooster knows his name, and stops as soon as he hears it called. But we can't be watching him all the time.
We have had a turken that was my favorite. His comb got a frostbite. There were no tips on it after the frostbite. And we do have some chickens that have some stange looking combs.

Haystack, thanks, I'll get back to you on the bubble foot, but I have to head off for work now.

And thanks ZZ. :)

Hey ZZ, you never experienced snow? Your welcome to come to Wisconsin anytime in the winter to see what it's like :)
Better yet, you won't have to wait. I'll send you a picture of our winters.
We had 2 years of almost record breaking snow falls in a row. The only year that had more was back in 1887 – 123.8”

In 2008 we had 109.0"

Want to come visit? :)

Come help shovel ZZ?

She will need socks.

Just socks?

Not just socks DIVINE socks.

Hmmmmm, there has to be an inside joke here.
Hmmmmmmm

Search the threads--kassy_51, and all will be revealed:0)

LOL, thanks Catscan, I found it.
But way to long for me to read it all now.
Need sleep, have to go to work again tonight. And the next night, and the next night, and the next night. and the next night. Then I have off for a week :)